What am I doing wrong? Heartfelt beads question.

[Jack Straw]

So, I put in some 65% heartfelt beads maybe a week and a half ago. It was a small round container that I could velcro to the roof, and was rated for 540 in^3 (my humi is not even 300 in^3)

I charged the beads, they were actually pretty much all clear rather than the "80% clear" it said in the directions (an accident, although I figured since it is winter I wouldn't have to worry about having too much humidity).

I have one cigar on Tuesday, seems fine if maybe a little on the dry side.

Note - this whole time, my analog hygro has been reading "a little below" what it had been reading with the standard humidifier, which seemed normal to me, seeing as they are 65% beads.

Fast forward to Friday, I pull out two cigars, and have one of them myself, and notice that it is quite dry - it is crackly and firm, tastes like ass, is difficult to get lit evenly, etc. Shame too, because it was a Perdomo Habano Corojo, which I have heard a few good things about. Go in and examine the rest of the lot, and they are also a bit crackly and firm feeling. I put the standard humidifier back in, along with 2 bottle caps with bits of wet paper towel in them, and it seems to have gotten "back on track." The cigars feel better, although I have not smoked one to test yet (yes, I'll call it "testing" heh.).

But here's the odd thing - you'd think that if it were the beads not adding enough humidity to the system, they would be white and dry, right? Not the case - they were actually mostly clear, with only a few that were starting to go white.

Questions:

So what am I doing wrong?

Why did the beads not go white? Were the cigars just pouring out H20 while the beads sucked it up, keeping my hygro at the expected level?

Can someone please tell me my cigars are not damaged?

Thanks,
Andrew

[piperman]

It will be hard to keep the humidity up in the winter if your running your heater, and I also I noticed you said analog meter, have you done a salt teat on it to see how far it is off? I live in AZ where we are lucky to get up to 20% humidity, I have my beads about 99% clear I think there might be one bead white, and I still have troubles keeping it a 63%. Your cigars are okay. just keep an eye on them.

[Jack Straw]

Originally Posted by piperman

It will be hard to keep the humidity up in the winter if your running your heater, and I also I noticed you said analog meter, have you done a salt teat on it to see how far it is off? I live in AZ where we are lucky to get up to 20% humidity, I have my beads about 99% clear I think there might be one bead white, and I still have troubles keeping it a 63%. Your cigars are okay. just keep an eye on them.

I have done the salt test, and with the standard humidifier I am getting 69-70% when it has rested and closer to 65% (as expected) with the beads. It is somewhat dry here but we have radiators rather than central air, and DC was built on a swamp. Either way, the humi has no problem holding humidity with the standard unit. Maybe it just releases moisture faster than the beads?

Thanks for the input - had a punch last night just to 'test,' and it was smoking great, so *phew*!

I may try running the two units in tandem.

[OracleSmoke]

#1 problem: very few analog (needle&scale) hygrometers are accurate these days. They're not always trustworthy even if you calibrate them 'cause you can't always be sure they're not getting stuck or that they are totally free of movement. Additionally, they don't take the ambient temperature into their reading even if they are accurate. Tap on it a bit and see if it moves for ya, if it does, throw it away and get a 17.00 digital RH hygrometer that you can salt cal.

#2 Beads are good for maintaining a humi already seasoned. I didn't read in your post what kinda box you're keeping your smokes in, so here's a start to finish tip: If this is a new setup and you're using a cedar humidor, you gotta season it first, meaning hydrate the wood interior before putting smokes in it. New humis are typically real dry depending on where they were stored before you bought it. If you gotta season it, wipe it down with a damp rag and maybe put a bowl of water in it for a day or so. Get that digital Hygro and leave it in the box for a few hours *after taking out the bowl of water . Check it and see where the stable humidity is in the box. Once you get around 70 or so go ahead and start putting smokes in and add your beads.

If the above doesn't apply to you, then I would suggest that your box is obviously dry and the analog hygro is way off, possibly stuck. The beads may not turn completely white overnight when giving up their moisture. They're meant more for taking up the slack when you open doors and let out some moisture.

If you're using a plastic box or cooler, it could be not enough beads for the size or again, your hygro is off.

Dry smokes aren't good either way, and if they're brittle and flaking, you can rehydrate them but they'll never taste the same.

Post more about your setup if you can. Good luck!

[blueeyedbum]

I live in MN and also have hot water heat. I have five humidors, A coolidor and three airtight Plastic containers. I use only beads in the cooler and plastic containers and the RH never varies. In winter, I struggled keeping the RH stable in the humidors using only beads. I have better results in the humidors using the humidifier that came with the humidor and the beads. I have also found that mesh bags allow the beads to wick more humidity than the tubes or jars, due to better air circulation and more surface area.

[Jack Straw]

Thanks guys - although it isn't a problem with the humidor, at least it doesn't leak more humidity than it should. It was seasoned and had been holding humidity quite well before this happened - I don't think the humidity got deathly low, the cigars went back to normal feeling within 2 days. Also, the fact that normal humidication got the humi back in shape in a day or two seems to point to the fact that it is not a humidor problem, but a humidifier problem.

In case you're interested, the humidor in question is in this thread: Sweeeeet. aka My First Humidor.

It is also pretty dang full, this picture was taken 3-4 cigars ago:



It's weird though, I've had the beads sitting out for two days on my dresser, and the beads still hadn't turned white even by yesterday afternoon. Weird, huh? I got a few (just a few) to turn white just by hitting it with a hairdryer for 2 minutes. Is it possible they're defective?

[OracleSmoke]

so the beads just weren't giving up enough for the box...

Hey, what's with the extra band on the 1666? Never seen that before.

Even cat litter beads give up moisture at a slow but reasonable rate... I don't suppose something got on the beads, like PG solution?

Got some nice smokes there... I'd be pissed too if they got wasted

[Jack Straw]

Originally Posted by OracleSmoke

so the beads just weren't giving up enough for the box...

Hey, what's with the extra band on the 1666? Never seen that before.

Even cat litter beads give up moisture at a slow but reasonable rate... I don't suppose something got on the beads, like PG solution?

Got some nice smokes there... I'd be pissed too if they got wasted

Yeah, I hope they're fine, it was only a few days, and the dry cigar I had was still smokable, although it wound up being a bit bland and it unravelled a bit about halfway through. I bet you have to really dry out a cigar to hurt it, maybe to the point that the innermost parts dry out as well? Had a punch on Monday and it seemed fine (well, delicious actually), maybe I'll test another one out tonight, just to be sure. There is nothing but distilled water at my house, so if it happened, it was in transit or at the seller's place. Good idea on the clogged beads, it seems to make sense to me, but is very disconcerting.

I've been curious about the extra band myself, I think it's something that CI puts on cigars to make them seem showier or something. If you look closely, you can see another one on the foot of a cigar on the right bottom, it's actually a RP Decade, and I know from getting those at the B&M that it is not a standard label. I think it's just a sales gimmick. They came in samplers. Although I don't see a need to dress up a decade, it already has some serious banding.

[Viper139]

You have received some good advice here and I just want to reinforce a few ideas you got from the folks. You should invest in a digital hygrometer, analog hygrometers are notoriously inaccurate. Analogs can give you a good reading one day and be 10% off the next day, they are just to be trusted.

As far as the beads go I assure you that there is no PG solution in the beads, in fact we do not even have PG solution in the building so contamination is not even possible. Just keep the beads hydrated so that roughly 90% of the beads are clear and give your humidor time to equalize in rh. It takes a little while for all thing to settle down in a humidor and it sounds like you are doing fine.

David

[Jack Straw]

Thanks again guys, I will surely order one when I get paid.

[Buddha024]

I'm wondering if it has to do with the container you have the beads in. It almost sounds to me like there isn't enough surface area for the beads to give off the moisture. Maybe that's why they didn't turn white when you left them out? I know it's not as convenient as the container you are using, but I bought a couple of disposable tupperware containers, cut holes in the lids, and put the beads in there. My cooler has been rock solid ever since. Never used them in a humi before though. Good luck.

[Jack Straw]

The thought did occur to me - maybe it would be worthwhile to drill small holes around the circumphrence of the casing, so that there is more flow through the unit. Of course, I'd have to find a way to get the beads out first, and wrap them in pantyhose or something so they don't fall out of the holes.

[Buddha024]

Originally Posted by Jack Straw

The thought did occur to me - maybe it would be worthwhile to drill small holes around the circumphrence of the casing, so that there is more flow through the unit. Of course, I'd have to find a way to get the beads out first, and wrap them in pantyhose or something so they don't fall out of the holes.

Sounds like it could be worth a try. The beads will still be good even if you mess up the container.

[Jack Straw]

Yeah, I was more worried about drilling into the beads and turning them to powder. I only have a black and decker "ladies drill" not a drill press so I can only be but so delicate. I assume the thing is just glued together, how hot can I get the beads before I start to hurt them?

[OracleSmoke]

Silica still performs it's funtion even if you powder it. You just increase the available surface area and cause it do perform it's function a bit faster. Something someone else touched on I think, is the beads work best when air can get to them. Burying beads in a deep container slows the circulation to the lower beads, slowing those beads ability to give up moisture to the box. I think that's why some folks put them in nylons, so air can get to more bead surface area simultaneously.

FWIW, my feeling is beads provide a nice buffer to RH changes due to door opening or outside the box changes. Trying to maintain RH in a huge humi solely with beads isn't economical because of the cost of the amount of beads to handle the job.

JMHO, but I think beads are better used in conjunction with an active device for a buffering effect. Besides which, using an active RH element circulates the air in the box, which helps even out the air density on the box and helps get the air around the paths around the smokes.

Again, not gospel, just thought. Sounds like you got smokeable stuff still and it'll be fine if it isn't already.

It's more of a worry with expensive smokes with sensitive cameroon wrappers that shred at the drop of a hat. Nothing worse having to endure the heartbreak of watching the wrapper disintegrate while smoking an 18.00 cigar