Puff Cigar Discussion Forums

Mark-60 · 08-01-2008, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuzi16

i understand that taxes are requitred to build roads and what not. Im ok with that. what i am not ok with is when Dems put "vice taxes" on cigarettes, spirits, cigars, or anything else that they see as "bad for society at large"
This is an attempt to control who we are and what we do.
In general, i am for keeping takes as low as we can. It was money that i worked hard to earn and i want to keep it in my pocket where it belongs. over 50% of our tax money goes to social programs... social programs that are quickly going bankrupt. ALL SOCIAL PROGRAMS WILL FAIL ALWAYS. Every social program/society that has ever existed or ever will exist will fail.
why?
the indavidual will not endlessly work for the benafit of the masses.

i probably pissed a bunch of you off. good.

oh, LFDs are good.

tnip23 · 08-01-2008, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kas

We obviously have different political philosophies, but that's what makes America great.
Here is a fact: the 35% tax rate applies only to every dollar earned above $357,000. And that's taxable income after exemptions and deductions.

What I don't understand about your point of view is why you think someone who earns more should have a higher tax rate than someone who makes less. The goal should be to encourage achievement, not punish it. They call the tax structure we have "progressive", I think it is regressive. When tax rates are high, people find more ways to hide income and that is part of the reason why(along with the creation of new jobs/taxpayers) every time we have a serious tax rate cut, tax revenues skyrocket. From what I have heard Rush say, he is a proponent of flat tax. I'm a fan of his, the flat tax, and the LFD dl chisel.

Freight Train · 08-01-2008, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kas

We obviously have different political philosophies, but that's what makes America great.
Here is a fact: the 35% tax rate applies only to every dollar earned above $357,000. And that's taxable income after exemptions and deductions.

By the way i make under 40k a year. Almost 700 dollars a month goes toward government programs and taxes.

Freight Train · 08-01-2008, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tnip23

What I don't understand about your point of view is why you think someone who earns more should have a higher tax rate than someone who makes less. The goal should be to encourage achievement, not punish it. They call the tax structure we have "progressive", I think it is regressive. When tax rates are high, people find more ways to hide income and that is part of the reason why(along with the creation of new jobs/taxpayers) every time we have a serious tax rate cut, tax revenues skyrocket. From what I have heard Rush say, he is a proponent of flat tax. I'm a fan of his, the flat tax, and the LFD dl chisel.

I love conservative thinking.

kas · 08-01-2008, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freight Train

By the way i make under 40k a year. Almost 700 dollars a month goes toward government programs and taxes.

Again, your math doesn't add up. That's more like 20% -- and I'm not sure what you mean by government programs AND taxes. When this discussion started, your complaint was that almost half of your income went to taxes. But whatever.

The reason the tax code includes progressively higher rates according to income is because 15% of someone's subsistence income is not the same as 15% of Bill Gates' income in terms of affordability. I'd love a flat tax if anyone could ever design one that is fair -- but it simply isn't fair on that basis.

Kalash · 08-01-2008, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freight Train

I promote what this country was founded upon. Some of which are individual rights, GOD, limited/SMALL government, limited taxes, right to own a gun, personal freedom, personal responsibility, and character. I am not politically correct... I am correct.

couldn't agree more

hdroadking · 08-01-2008, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kas

The reason the tax code includes progressively higher rates according to income is because 15% of someone's subsistence income is not the same as 15% of Bill Gates' income in terms of affordability. I'd love a flat tax if anyone could ever design one that is fair -- but it simply isn't fair on that basis.

my daddy always told me...life ain't fair. you gotta work your butt off to get ahead.

Freight Train · 08-01-2008, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kas

Again, your math doesn't add up. That's more like 20% -- and I'm not sure what you mean by government programs AND taxes. When this discussion started, your complaint was that almost half of your income went to taxes. But whatever.

The reason the tax code includes progressively higher rates according to income is because 15% of someone's subsistence income is not the same as 15% of Bill Gates' income in terms of affordability. I'd love a flat tax if anyone could ever design one that is fair -- but it simply isn't fair on that basis.

Look bro. I know what I make and I know what the government takes out of my check. State, fed, and local taxes. Social security and Medicare both of which i will never see (both are broke programs). All of these deductions equal over 700 dollars a month. I guess we disagree on the basis that i think my money is my money and not the governments. This is America right?

kas · 08-01-2008, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freight Train

Look bro. I know what I make and I know what the government takes out of my check. State, fed, and local taxes. Social security and Medicare both of which i will never see (both are broke programs). All of these deductions equal over 700 dollars a month. I guess we disagree on the basis that i think my money is my money and not the governments. This is America right?

Nah, I just don't get the math. Seems like a moving target.

But no harm, no foul. I've enjoyed the discussion, and your willingness to defend your position respectfully.

andrewsutherland2002 · 08-01-2008, 05:57 PM

So, how bout those Reds? I hear they're trading Griffey to the ChiSox.

tnip23 · 08-01-2008, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kas

The reason the tax code includes progressively higher rates according to income is because 15% of someone's subsistence income is not the same as 15% of Bill Gates' income in terms of affordability. I'd love a flat tax if anyone could ever design one that is fair -- but it simply isn't fair on that basis.

Every flat tax proposal I have seen starts the taxation at a certain level of income, so someone on a true "subsistence" income would not be taxed. Fair is everyone over that subsistence line paying the same rate. We have far too few taxpayers footing the majority of the bill in this country and not that it should matter, but I am not in the top tax bracket. I just don't have a hatred or jealousy for/of those who are.

Freight Train · 08-01-2008, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andrewsutherland2002

So, how bout those Reds? I hear they're trading Griffey to the ChiSox.

Griffy is one of my Favorites. I wish he would have been healther over the course of his career.

kas · 08-01-2008, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tnip23

Every flat tax proposal I have seen starts the taxation at a certain level of income, so someone on a true "subsistence" income would not be taxed. Fair is everyone over that subsistence line paying the same rate. We have far too few taxpayers footing the majority of the bill in this country and not that it should matter, but I am not in the top tax bracket. I just don't have a hatred or jealousy for/of those who are.

Me either; I love everyone. And my dog seems to love me.