Did Pepin sell his soul?

[Lok17]

Originally Posted by Ehlonya

LOL, now if pepin had dropped the Tats outta the loop then you guys will all be whining up the river.

BITE YOUR TOUNGE!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Ehlonya]

Originally Posted by Lok17

BITE YOUR TOUNGE!!!!!!!!!!!!

Think of it this way, if tats weren't made anymore and they are quite popular, that'll make them a highly prized commodity thus skyrocketing their value at least 5 times a stick.

[luckyfitz13]

Pepins stuff is great, love the blue and the Black and think they are great $8 cigars but not $12+........i think he is making a mistake in doing this

[Ehlonya]

Originally Posted by luckyfitz13

Pepins stuff is great, love the blue and the Black and think they are great $8 cigars but not $12+........i think he is making a mistake in doing this

Ahhh when did dpg's jumped to 12 a stick or are you talking about the "el centurions"?

[jitzy]

well TJ was discussing this in his podcast so I thought I would comment again on something else I noticed today about Pepin and Holts he is also making there new connoisseur collection for them too how many different blends are there now just for holts alone. Look like I said before everyone is entitled to make money and yes black cat could of handled it better but like I said in an earlier post if he did this to pete johnson I bet thoughts would be different.

[Harpo Marx]

Originally Posted by jitzy

Its all about making money to some and to me thats all well and good but don't screw your friends. I said it at the herf the other night pepin is getting a little carried away lately with all the cigars he makes. Its funny when gurkha keeps putting out different lines people laugh and knock them when pepin does it people go crazy and gobble them up. (I will acknowledge that alot of the stuff he does put out is fantastic but still he's putting out a new cigar almost every month)

Hmmm....seems like he is following the Gurkha sales model...too bad...
It's almost like a good strong fresh cup of coffee and a little cream...then more cream....and more cream....soon, you just have mud.

[Harpo Marx]

Originally Posted by jitzy

well TJ was discussing this in his podcast so I thought I would comment again on something else I noticed today about Pepin and Holts he is also making there new connoisseur collection for them too how many different blends are there now just for holts alone. Look like I said before everyone is entitled to make money and yes black cat could of handled it better but like I said in an earlier post if he did this to pete johnson I bet thoughts would be different.

Yeah...too many people think that once you make the big time, it's OK to screw the little people who made you big, who believed in you when others wouldn't....I'm a little person & I'm tired of being screwed. JMHO!

[jam]

Originally Posted by Harpo Marx

Yeah...too many people think that once you make the big time, it's OK to screw the little people who made you big, who believed in you when others wouldn't....I'm a little person & I'm tired of being screwed. JMHO!

Thats for sure .........I remember 15 maybe more years ago when aliados and puros indios was a small store front in New jersey, aliados was a excellent cigar when they signed with J&R it went downhill so fast the blends were different and aliados will tell you they are different from the 80s

its all about money

[PMM88Jr]

Sounds like a sad state of affairs. But, IMHO, if someone's heart isn't into the partnership, then that individual should have the right to dissolve it. However, real men face their battles head on. If I don't want to do business with you, I'll tell you. Not some hired gun or liaison.

[Fishhound-cl]

Sorry but I'm going to have to go against the grain here. Say what you want but Pepin has some real talent. I don't blame the man for doing better for himself. I ask anyone of you, if you had the opportunity to double your salary tomorrow by working for someone else would you? I know I would.

I have been a fan of Pepin's blends and his line for since I have tried them and will continue to be for as long as he keeps putting out the great products that he has in the past. It is a shame some good cigars get lost from the change but that is part of the business. It always has been and always will be.

[jitzy]

Originally Posted by Fishhound

Sorry but I'm going to have to go against the grain here. Say what you want but Pepin has some real talent. I don't blame the man for doing better for himself. I ask anyone of you, if you had the opportunity to double your salary tomorrow by working for someone else would you? I know I would.

I have been a fan of Pepin's blends and his line for since I have tried them and will continue to be for as long as he keeps putting out the great products that he has in the past. It is a shame some good cigars get lost from the change but that is part of the business. It always has been and always will be.

dont get me wrong I agree with you your in business to make money not for charity and I bet he will sell alot more cigars thru holts than black cat. the one thing I'm saying is have the decentcy to call him yourself. I also will say we dont know how close of friends these guys where I do myself have mixed feelings about this whole situation.

[tx_tuff]

This is what I think. I doubt very much that Black Cat help Don Pepin out more than he was helping them! I never heard of Black Cat untill this, I doubt very much that they made him like the claim. Does it make a difference? Guess you have to decide that for yourself. But if I run a business that sells something and a company decides to stop providing me with that product I don't really expect the owner to call and tell me.

[Phantom57-cl]

I don't understand the concern with Garcia's business getting bigger, not like he personally rolls them all, or even sees them. I don't work for Garcia, and don't think anyone on this board does either, so where is this coming from. Oliva and AF consistently produce near flawless products and they are not small companies.

As far as ethics go, businesses are not exempt, just because they are in business. That is just a quick cheap excuse for actions less than honorable. I am a bit surprised how quick so many are to jump on Garcia without a response from him.

[ashauler]

This is simply ridiculous and the result of one person interpreting a relationship to be one thing.........and the other person seeing it as another.

No matter how you slice it, if you're into cigars to make money, its a business.........and all relationships that further your goals are just that, business. If you think manufacturers have any other goal at the root of their activities, imho, you are mistaken.

[baboruger]

I think that is one of the issues, people see these guys a celebrities at events and what not and not as businessmen. Does anyone think the CEO of most companies calls to tell a store they are discontinuing something, nope, but that is what happened here, delegation. These guys are not making cigars just because we like them, or they like a guy at a shop, they are in this to make money, just like Microsoft.

Now I understand that this is a fun hobby for us, but for anyone other than the end user (us) this is a business just like Microsoft and others. Maybe there needs to be a change in how big business works, but this seems like the norm to me. I think that large companies (Pepin) always give the appearance of taking advantage of the little guy, like most people who have posted in this thread seem to imply. But they are just doing what is best for their company. The cost/benefit of producing these small batch cigars was not worth it with more valuable contracts out there. Holts is a HUGE sales machine, and that's where the money is rather than BlackCat.

I think that some people are also missing the point here when they talk about "if this happens to Pete Johnson I would like to hear what you say." It could very well happen to Tatuaje and I would not change my mind. I doubt that Pepin would want to rid himself of that cash cow, but I would guess that if he did there would be a monetary reason behind it.

This is an industry just like any other, and people need to realize that these guys are out to have a successful business and sometimes people have their toes stepped on, but that happens in any industry.

If the industry is to keep growing and being profitable for people like Pepin, then I see this as a good step as you sometimes need to divest yourself from small less profitable brands and focus on the cash cows in order to survive, especially with the economy like it is.

Just some thoughts...

Originally Posted by ashauler

This is simply ridiculous and the result of one person interpreting a relationship to be one thing.........and the other person seeing it as another.

No matter how you slice it, if you're into cigars to make money, its a business.........and all relationships that further your goals are just that, business. If you think manufacturers have any other goal at the root of their activities, imho, you are mistaken.