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Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

This is a discussion on Boveda Packets Not Holding RH within the General Cigar Discussion forums, part of the The Cigar Lounges at Puff category; Hello Everyone, Thrilled to become a member of this huge forum. I'm writing to you from Israel. In the past ...

  
  1. #1

    Young Puffer Fish TheWorldIsYours's Avatar


     

    Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

    Hello Everyone, Thrilled to become a member of this huge forum.

    I'm writing to you from Israel. In the past 2 months i've made the switch from traditional humidity foam to BOVEDA packets due to the many good reviews it has. I first started with 65 and then moved to the 72 packets.


    I have a glass top humidor by quality importers (50 CT), and i have seasoned it and reseasoned it. i did the reseasoning with both the 84 packet (for about 5 days) and the 72 packet (for the last 7 days). - Throughout the reseasoning process it held a steady 70% RH.


    I also have another glass top humidor (20 CT) - seasoned it for 14 days with the 84 packet as instructed.


    I keep both of the humidors in my closet away from sunlight and i i'm really struggling maintaining the RH levels - in the 50ct humidor (has aprox 20 cigars) i use 5 72% packs and it doesn't go above 65% RH.


    In the 20ct humidor i use 3 65% packets and it has dropped from 62% to 61% (and it has only 5 cigars in it).

    All packets are pretty fresh and not dry.

    I have 2 digital hygros which are both calibrated twice (with boveda packs).

    I don't use anything else other than Boveda packets.

    The temperature in the humidors is usually between 78F to 81F (pretty hot in the summer now).



    I should also mention that when the humidors were empty (no cigars in it) it held the RH just fine (70% with the 72 packets, and 64% with the 65 packets).


    Also, i tried putting the cigars and the packets in a sealed tupperware - it held the RH perfect.


    I don't know what i'm doing wrong - why are my humidors not holding the RH ?


    Any help would be much appreciated.

  2. #2

    Aw, You just made me ink defetis's Avatar


     

    Re: Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

    The problem is your humidors dont have good seals and you need more cigars in your humidors to help stabilize

  3. #3

    Maturing Puffer Fish Saltmarsh's Avatar


     

    Re: Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

    Maybe to glass top isn't holding a good seal. Or maybe the cigar are very dry to start with. New cigars are usually very wet, my RH goes up when I put new cigars in, but drops down over a week or two. I live in FL USA and we are in our wet season. Is your season now dry?

  4. #4

    True Derelict Fuzzy's Avatar


     

    Re: Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

    Do a leak test on the seal around the top. I used a dollar bill and determined this seal was good. The bill was put in the top and the covver was closed. There was an equal amount of pressure around the lid so it was determined the this was not the problem.

    My guess is your humidors are leaking, probably at the glass but maybe from somewhere else. You may need to seal the glass with some sort of food grade sealant.

    Also, on the glass top humi I had, the bottom was almost paper thin. On mine, after sealing the glass with a bead of silicone on the outside of the humi, I had to add an extra layer of wood to the bottom. Since I did not have Spanish cedar, I attached the wood to the outside with wood glue and clamped it for a day.
    I don't always drink beer,,,
    OK, yes I do

  5. #5

    Leading Puffer Fish Drez_'s Avatar


     

    Re: Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

    Quote Originally Posted by asafnawi@gmail.com View Post
    Hello Everyone, Thrilled to become a member of this huge forum.

    I'm writing to you from Israel. In the past 2 months i've made the switch from traditional humidity foam to BOVEDA packets due to the many good reviews it has. I first started with 65 and then moved to the 72 packets.


    I have a glass top humidor by quality importers (50 CT), and i have seasoned it and reseasoned it. i did the reseasoning with both the 84 packet (for about 5 days) and the 72 packet (for the last 7 days). - Throughout the reseasoning process it held a steady 70% RH.


    I also have another glass top humidor (20 CT) - seasoned it for 14 days with the 84 packet as instructed.


    I keep both of the humidors in my closet away from sunlight and i i'm really struggling maintaining the RH levels - in the 50ct humidor (has aprox 20 cigars) i use 5 72% packs and it doesn't go above 65% RH.

    That actually sounds pretty good. If it stays steady at 65%, that is what a good number of the population of the forum prefer. While it shouldn't take 5 72% packs to stabilize there, if it holds there then I wouldn't fuss with that formula much. Just keep an eye on the packs and make sure they stay fresh.

    In the 20ct humidor i use 3 65% packets and it has dropped from 62% to 61% (and it has only 5 cigars in it).

    This is likely due to needing more cigars to help balance the humidity. The wood will keep trying to absorb moisture. With only Boveda producing it, they will eventually lose. Especially if there is also some sealing issues. I'd throw another 5-10 cigars if possible, and see if it comes up once everything acclimates.

    All packets are pretty fresh and not dry.

    I have 2 digital hygros which are both calibrated twice (with boveda packs).

    I don't use anything else other than Boveda packets.

    The temperature in the humidors is usually between 78F to 81F (pretty hot in the summer now).



    I should also mention that when the humidors were empty (no cigars in it) it held the RH just fine (70% with the 72 packets, and 64% with the 65 packets).


    Also, i tried putting the cigars and the packets in a sealed tupperware - it held the RH perfect.


    I don't know what i'm doing wrong - why are my humidors not holding the RH ?


    Any help would be much appreciated.

    Everything has to play balance with each other. If the cigars are dry, it will take them some time to absorb and balance. If your humidor was holding fine before adding them, this could be part of the reason for the drop once you added the cigars. - In the tupperware, it is truly an air tight seal with no absorbtion or loss from elements other than the cigars themselves. It takes far less Boveda in that type of environment, so they will read proper RH more readily, even if the cigars are dry.

    It's really just easier to go that route, and makes for far less stress on making sure everything is correct.. The only thing I would add is..try to drop that temperature by at least 10-12 degrees if in any way possible.
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  6. #6

    Puffer Fish with many spikes ShaneG's Avatar


     

    Re: Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

    Are your packets the right size? Boveda makes packets that are the size of a salt packet, and the ones for humidors that are much larger. If you have three humidor size packs in a 20 count humi that's like half full of boveda and should be close to maintaining no matter the seals, unless you darn near keep the thing open!
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  7. #7

    Alpha Puffer Fish Cigar-Enthusiast's Avatar


     

    Re: Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

    I have the same humidor or something similar and I had the same problem. It was easily fixed by adding blue painter's tape to the lid. Here's a thread where you can see some photos on where to put it. Also you can get Aquarium grade silicone if you believe the leak is in the glass and put it on the outside, so you won't have to worry about re-seasoning the humidor. Basically you want something that's not toxic to fish because it won't intoxicate your sticks. There's a picture of that posted as well.

    Adding Blue Painter's Tape to Improve the Humidor Seal
    Boveda Packets Not Holding RH-81518d1383180149-adding-blue-painters-tape-improve-humidor-seal-humidor-blue-tape.jpg
    Name:  62c349b1-361b-48f2-8230-acd75eea6222_65.jpg
Views: 281
Size:  1.2 KBBoveda Packets Not Holding RH-7da42b9a-247b-4239-8443-69147ce85499_400.jpg
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  8. #8

    Puffer Fish with some spikes magoo6541's Avatar


     

    Re: Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

    I believe that Boveda says that in wooden humidors, you can expect your rH within 5% of the published rH on the packets. You say in the 50 ct humi you're using 72%rH and achieving 65%rH and in the 20 ct you're using 65%rH and achieving 61%rH. I don't know what kind of hydrometer you have but most have a 1%-2% +/- error rate.

    You're actually not too far off of where you should be and both 61%rH & 65%rH are about perfect for habano cigars which is what I suspect you have since you're in Israel.

    You said that empty, your humidors held more close to the right rH and once you added cigars, the rH dropped. It seems to me that the only variable is that cigars have been added. How long did you let the rH settle out? Did you wait for a couple hours or did you wait a couple days before declaring that the rH is off? Are you using the 60g packs or the 8g packs?

    Sometimes it can take a while for the rH to balance out. Especially if the rH of your boxes or cigars is much higher or lower than your humidor.

  9. #9

    Puffer Fish with some spikes ryanmac45's Avatar


     

    Re: Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

    Welcome aboard, you've certainly come to right place for commeraderie, advice, and BS.. I mean expertise...
    I sympathize with your issues, but I'm thinking that you should consider a different storage method, even if just temporary.
    In an environment with varying temps and humidity, I'd utilize something synthetic like a cooler.
    Get those smokes stabilized and safe as soon as possible. The 65 boveda's will work better too. Just my two cents.
    *** Semper Fidelis .... Semper Liber ***

  10. #10

    GVH
    GVH is offline
    Puffer Fish with some spikes GVH's Avatar


     

    Re: Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

    Welcome! My suggestion given the climate you live in is to keep most of your cigars in sealed containers - like a "Tupperdor" with Boveda packs, and use your wood humidor(s) to store the cigars you will be smoking in the next ____ days. Just remember to open the airtight containers frequently (cigars like to breathe). I use a wood humidor to hold one of each brand of cigars I own - and keep it at 65% RH - I use 69% Boveda packs in my sealed containers - and let them dry out a bit in the humidor prior to smoking. When I take one from the Humidor, I replace it from storage right away. Your other problem is clearly temperature. You have to find a way to get your cigars closer to 70 degrees or less. Cigar flavors are all about the volatile oils in the tobacco - and heat and those oils don't play well together. The other comments that have been posted are quite valid. It might help you to visit JR Cigars and read JR'S Cigars 101 on storing cigars and relative humidity. Just his opinions, but he is a main player in the business. Good luck! George
    Life is short, death is certain....enjoy your best cigar today!

  11. #11

    Puffer Fish with some spikes DrBob's Avatar


     

    Re: Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

    I am in New Mexico which I imagine has a similar dry climate to Israel. I had the same humidor and constantly fought to keep its RH stable, and ultimately failed. Boveda's did work the best, but the box was just too leaky to stabilize in a dry climate, even with lots of retrofitting. Staying with boveda's I went to a large acrylic jar for up on deck cigars, and a small wineador for longer term storage. In both of these the Boveda's work great and stay spot on. I will post a pic of my Jarador when I get home.

  12. #12

    Puffer Fish with some spikes DrBob's Avatar


     

    Re: Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

    I have a Boveda 2 pack cedar holder in the middle with two packs in it. Seals very tight and hold about 40 cigars up to Churchill in length. the wineador is just an 8 bottle model but it hold 3 cedar trays, and a few small boxes and about 150 cigars total. It holds RH very well, though the hygrometer drops instantly when the door is opened, but recovers quickly. With all the trays and boxes and Boveda holders the cedar smell is amazing when you crack it open .

    Boveda Packets Not Holding RH-img_20140621_162932.jpgBoveda Packets Not Holding RH-img_20140621_165814.jpg
    Last edited by DrBob; 06-21-2014 at 08:03 PM.

  13. #13

    Young Puffer Fish TheWorldIsYours's Avatar


     

    Re: Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

    Ok guys,

    First of all i can't thank you enough for your help, and it amazes me how people are willing to help, so A HUGE THANK YOU FOR EVERYONE HERE !!

    Cigar-Enthusiast - I followed your advice and sealed the top glass with aquarium grade silicone + taped all around the lid reaaaaally nice with a painter's tape. It is now extremely tight when closing - I'll upload photos later today.
    After doing so and with the 5 packets (72s) inside it spiked to 67%, but now down to 65% (again - few hours after reopening the humidor, maybe it'll come back to 67 ?? but with 5 packets inside i would expect it to be more than 67 or to stay solid at that point).

    I have also got a response from BOVEDA customer service (which advised to check leakage as well), and i'm starting to think that maybe i didn't season the humidor with enough 84 packets, or that MAYBE MY BOVEDA 2 PACKET HOLDER IS STEALING THE RH ??...

    TEMP wise - i can't really think of any way to lower the temp other than placing it somewhere else in the house - and the closet seems the coolest place, not being affected by the dry air from the AC.

    ShaneG - my packets are the large size.

    DrBob - thanks a lot for the advice and the photos. i guess it would be agood idea to put them in a tight sealed environment, but IMO the whole beauty of cigar storage is putting them in a nice looking humidor.

    I guess i pretty much did everything, so i will try to let it stabilize for a few days and i'll keep you posted. Maybe i'll consider reseasoning again or as a final step buy a more expensive humi.

    AGAIN, THANKS A LOT TO EVERYONE !
    Last edited by asafnawi@gmail.com; 06-22-2014 at 08:42 AM.

  14. #14

    Not actually a fish. danmdevries's Avatar


     

    Re: Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

    Brother in law had a heck of a time getting his glass top to work. This is the one he has I was at his house and saw him wiping down the interior surfaces with a sponge and distilled water and asked him why he was torturing the wood like that. Especially these cheapo humidors, they're usually a very thin veneer over pressboard (look closely at the lip that the base sits in) and direct moisture contact is NOT GOOD! There's no reason to wipe down wood with water.

    He was about to toss it in frustration and stick with tupperdors (not a bad idea..) but I asked him to let me have it for a while and I'd sort it out.

    Couple things:

    Problem: The base of the humidor is extremely thin. 1/8" at best. It took all of a finger push to break it away from the bottom. The felt was the only thing holding it on.



    My fix: Cut a piece of plexiglas to fit the base of the humidor and silicone it to the super thin base.



    Problem: The front mount hygrometer does not seal around its perimeter. The gasket that holds it in place isn't a continuous-contact gasket, instead it has peaks and valleys which leaves a lot of open space for air exchange



    My fix: disassemble hygrometer and superglue the dial at the humidity reading he wanted. Just to make it look pretty (70), reassemble and reinstall, then silicone a piece of plexiglas over the entire hole on the inside, totally blocking off the hole.

    (No pics - but just that - a rectangle of plexiglas to fit over the hole)

    Problem: The lid seal didn't do a darn thing. The 4 pieces of wood were poorly fitted and not well fastened to the lid, allowing too much movement of the slats.

    My fix: Remove all 4 pieces of wood from the seal and apply a bead of silicone to hold them in place, then used a couple small pin nails to hold them in place to the outside. Now when the lid closes, if you let it down gently, it needs a little push to close all the way.



    Problem: The glass isn't sealed in place

    My fix: after removing the 4 slats of the lid seal, I removed the 4 pieces of the glass seal. I then applied silicone to the glass and put in place, applied silicone around the entire perimeter, and glued the wood back into place before gluing and nailing the lid seal slats back into their spots.



    Problem: The factory humidification device sucks.

    My fix: While you've already addressed this with Boveda packs, my fix was to put a half pound of 70% HF beads in the box. Mind you I did this in February and we had a brutally cold and dry winter. The beads held on at 68% without issue.



    Final step: I added oversaturated 70% beads to help stabilize the moisture content of the wood "seasoning" and taped around the lid of the box and let it sit for two weeks before touching it again. It held solid as seen in the picture above, so I loaded it up and properly bombed him with some cigars, a new digital hygrometer and a half pound of HF beads



    Bottom line is these cheap humidors are made for ease of construction and low cost of production. If you want to make em work, you're going to have to either ditch it for a tupperdor or put some work into it because the manufacturer did not. Or you can spend several hundred on a quality unit. Personally, I'd recommend going with tupperware or doing my fixes. I spent about $15 on materials (plexiglas, tiny nails, foodsafe silicone) $20 on a good digital hygrometer for him, and $25 on Heartfelt beads. So about $60 plus a little time (less than an hour total I think) and he's got a humidor that performs nearly as well as my $$$ desktop.

    I apologize the pictures aren't the greatest, but they were the only ones I had on my phone of the process. If/when I do another I'll take more detailed procedural pictures and post a step by step demonstration.
    Last edited by danmdevries; 06-22-2014 at 10:28 AM.

  15. #15

    Young Puffer Fish TheWorldIsYours's Avatar


     

    Re: Boveda Packets Not Holding RH

    Wow danmdevries, thanks a lot for all the info. Ok here's what i did so far:

    1. Aquarium siliconed the outer space between the glass and the wood.
    2. painter taped the inner "male" part of the lid until it got really snug.
    3. Electric taped around the analog hygro until i got a really snug fit (got rid of the original silicone ring that came with it).
    4. Aquarium siliconed the inner bottom and corners parts of the wood and some loose spaces.

    Here are the results:

    Boveda Packets Not Holding RH-photo-1.jpg
    Boveda Packets Not Holding RH-photo-2.jpg
    Boveda Packets Not Holding RH-photo-3.jpg
    Boveda Packets Not Holding RH-photo-4.jpg
    Boveda Packets Not Holding RH-photo-5.jpg

    Now the questions are:

    1. how long until the silicone cures ?
    2. will i need to re season ?
    3. can i re season with 72 boveda packs ? if so how ?

    Thank you everyone !

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