My Opinion on NCs and ISOMs

[ca21455]

[SIZE=3]I have read a lot about comparisons of ISOMs and NCs. So here is my two cents.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=3]First some background:[/SIZE]

[SIZE=3]To differentiate a good cigar from a dog rocket it must look good. Be well constructed and cut squarely. Light easily and burn even with a good solid ash. Draw well with lots of smoke volume and perform consistently throughout the smoke. Not taste like garbage. The cigar should feel good in your mouth and not be sticky or rough.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=3]To take the cigar to the next level it must have a flavor that I enjoy and not get harsh toward the end. I like a cigar with full strength, but a super strong cigar does not always equate to a great cigar. The Joya De Nicaragua Antano Robusto is the strongest cigar I have smoked. It was good but not the best since it powered its way from the start to finish with no subtleness in flavor.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=3]An exceptional cigar must have rich complex flavors that develop throughout the smoke. The after taste should be enjoyable and last long after the smoke is finished.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=3]From my limited experience with ISOMs, they have fit the bill for exceptional cigars. The Cohiba Robusto comes to mind. The ISOMs had the advantage of being smoked on vacation in great surroundings and shared with true lovers of the leaf.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=3]The best cigar I have had to date is the Don Pepin Garcia Imperiales. It met all my criteria in aces.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=3]So are ISOMs better then NCs? From my limited experience I would have to say there are many NCs that fall short and the Cubans seem to be consistently good smokes.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=3]I have to say it is a tie for me at this time. As I experience more ISOMs my opinion may change. However a great smoke is one you share and enjoy with friends! [/SIZE]

[SIZE=3]Hope all your smokes are pleasurable experiences![/SIZE]

[Ashcan Bill]

Originally Posted by ca21455

However a great smoke is one you share and enjoy with friends!

I certainly agree with this. Whether it's a good meal, a good drink or a good cigar, I think it's being able to share the experience with friends that brings me the most enjoyment.

Not to say I don't agree with the rest of what you said.

[icehog3]

Originally Posted by ca21455

As I experience more ISOMs my opinion may change.

Yes, it very well may.

[montecristo#2]

Originally Posted by ca21455

[SIZE=3]
[SIZE=3]The best cigar I have had to date is the Don Pepin Garcia Imperiales. It met all my criteria in aces.[/SIZE]

Wow, I really have to try one of these. I got a four pack sampler from Holt's and decided to put the imperiales in the movie pass since I was going through an anti-torpedo phase.

I'm really glad you liked this smoke. I have had some really good cigars from both sources. I really like the tatuajes (also from Pepin) these days and find them to be right on with what I currently like. I know what I am going to get, whereas, I am still too inexperienced with the forbidden fruit, some are right on, some are way off. At least for me, I prefer nicaraguan tobacco over stuff from the DR (except for fuente anejos).

Experimentation is the key to this hobby.

If you haven't picked up the sampler from CigarKing yet, you might want to purchase one of these. Pepin is on fire right now and is rolling the best stuff outside of cuba.

By the way, thanks for the trader feedback for putting this one into the pass.

[daviddunn]

Beautifully said, thank you for your post, I quite enjoyed reading it. =)

[qwerty1500]

I'm still a Habanos newbie but I'm putting a good dent in the "Beginners List."

Here's my

Havana cigars taste COMPLETELY different than anything else out there. I've smoked a lot of NCs and Habanos are just an entirely different profile.

After a year and a half smoking cigars, I really don't have what I'd call a developed palate. Hey, right now, I seem to be enjoying young Habanos more than some with 5-6 years one them.

But, I know what I like.

There are plenty of good NCs out there. Still exploring Tatajuie ... love them! And the AVOs and Davidoffs are truely great cigars. They don't taste anything like a Habanos but I don't want them to taste like one. I love them for what they are.

Nevertheless, I seem to reach for a Habanos 80% of the time.

[floydp]

Originally Posted by icehog3

Yes, it very well may.

Indeed..

[ca21455]

Originally Posted by montecristo#2

If you haven't picked up the sampler from CigarKing yet, you might want to purchase one of these. Pepin is on fire right now and is rolling the best stuff outside of cuba.

By the way, thanks for the trader feedback for putting this one into the pass.

Your weclome Aaron! I blame you and Scottie for putting a dent in my credit card. I ordered two of the sampler packs and they should arrive on Wednesday. My next purchase will be a box of the Imperiales. They were not listed on the Cigar King site but Holts has them for $150 a box.

[IHT]

Originally Posted by ca21455

[SIZE=3]
To differentiate a good cigar from a dog rocket it must look good.
IHT - why?

Be well constructed and cut squarely.
IHT - cut squarely?

Light easily and burn even with a good solid ash.
IHT - why does the density of the ash matter?

Draw well with lots of smoke volume and perform consistently throughout the smoke. Not taste like garbage.
IHT - ya think? that should be the only thing that matters. if it doesn't draw well or produce smoke, it will probably taste like garbage or nothing at all. taste should've been your first factor in determining a good cigar from a dog rocket.

The cigar should feel good in your mouth and not be sticky or rough.[/SIZE]
IHT - sticky or rough? never had one of those, what cigars have been sticky and/or rough for you (so i know what to stay away from)?

nice post, but i don't understand the parts i quoted.
how a cigar looks
how dense the ash is
i've never heard the term "cut squarely" before (what does that mean)
i've never had a cigar feel sticky or rough

seriously, why would the look, ash density, and how well you cut it change the flavor of a cigar? isn't it only about flavor, or did i totally miss something when i enjoyed my cigars?

[ca21455]

Originally Posted by IHT

nice post, but i don't understand the parts i quoted.

how a cigar looks
This is the first impression I have of a cigar. It also has a large effect on if I purchase the cigar or not when I am in a cigar store. For example I shy away from a cigar with a color or shape that does not attract my attention. This may be keeping me from some real good cigars, but I am still learning.

how dense the ash is
I smoke outside. If the ash is really flakey it gets all over the place and makes a mess. Does it affect taste? No, but it makes my smoking experience less enjoyable.

i've never heard the term "cut squarely" before (what does that mean)
If the cap is poorly made, the edges will be rough when cut or some cigars will unravel when cut. I guess what I was trying to say was a good clean cut. I have also had some cigars that have a bunch of junk hanging out from the filler (stems, veins, whatever) after cutting. This really bugs me. I have two good cutters and expect the cap be made good enough to not cause any problems. A good example is Sancho Panza. I love the taste of these cigars but the cap drives me crazy. They do not cut clean and are always unraveling.

i've never had a cigar feel sticky or rough
By sticky I mean that the wrapper sticks to your lips, probably because the cigar is dry and lacks oil. The last cigar I had like that was a Helix given as a freebee at a B&M. There is also a "feel" that I get when the cigar is smoked. I like a well made torpedo with a very smooth wrapper. Poorly made caps just don't feel right, hard to explain.

seriously, why would the look, ash density, and how well you cut it change the flavor of a cigar? isn't it only about flavor, or did i totally miss something when i enjoyed my cigars?
Yes, flavor is the main factor in deciding if you like a cigar or not. If it is perfect in every way but tastes like crap, it is a looser. I am a visual person so the other factors may affect me more then other people.

Thanks for all the great questions Greg.

[Poriggity]

Im with IHT on this one.. Im not understanding some of the parts.. Ive had quite a few "rough" looking and feeling cigars that were very good. They also didn't have the greatest ash, but they were still tasty.
Scott

[donp]

Following is an excerpt from the Fall 2005 edition of Smoke Magazine (Vol. 10; No. 4); Smoke Primer: "Looking Past Havana" ...Michael Herklots.

"many of the non-cuban manufacturers are using excellent tobacco that has been properly aged, and are blending in a unique manner that gives each brand a distnctive character....most of these manufacturers are blending with the intention of showing the characteristics of their tobacco, and not trying to slavishly ape those of Cuba's."
Further: " I also believe that part of the overall flavor of a cigar is passion....Each manufacturer is creating a cigar using the techniques and styles that they believe in, solidifying the brand's distinction and inimitability (incapable of being imitated)....manufacturers in Cuba cannot use this type of individual discretion and approach because they're making cigars that they're ordered to make. Cuban brands no longer represent a family or a story or a passion, but rather a government."

I was gifted a couple of Cuban cigars this past Friday night by a friend, his gift was generous and unsolicited; he said he can get more. I am intrigued but not beside myself with glee; I figure I have a lot of very good nc cigars and still more to discover however, I am glad they are there and that I can expand my horizons. I appreciated the article by Herklots, it put things in perspective for me. I know that I am in the midst of appreciating a good cigar, and perhaps next week, an even finer cigar than I had the week before. For me, this is a big part of the journey in this hobby. It also helped me realize it would be foolhardy to forsake a damned fine nc simply because it is not a cuban, and I expect that when I do expand my horizons into cuban cigars, I will be able to appreciate a fine cigar largely because of my broader experience with smoking non cubans.
(Sorry for the length of this post)

[monte2]

Originally Posted by Poriggity

Im with IHT on this one.. Im not understanding some of the parts.. Ive had quite a few "rough" looking and feeling cigars that were very good. They also didn't have the greatest ash, but they were still tasty.
Scott

I understand most of the points being made here, especially about the look of the construction. If they can't even make the cigar look decent imagine what they used for tobacco. That being said I"ve never had a bad Henry Clay cigar, and they will never win a prize for beauty.

[IHT]

Originally Posted by ca21455

Thanks for all the great questions Greg.

thanks for the answers.

i don't know what to tell you about the clean cut of the cigar. is it the cigars fault most of the time, or the person doing the cutting and the cutter they're using? i do agree, if you get a cigar with sh*tloads of stems and "short filler" falling out of the end of the cigar, doesn't add to the enjoyment.

my point about the ash to counter your point - why are you keeping the ash hanging on your cigar so long? is there a benefit to leaving an ash on there until it's so long it ends up making a mess when it falls unexpectadly? if the ash is long enough to "ash", i do it. i don't get glamour points for having a 2 inch ash when that 1.5 inches of it will accidentally fall on my silk hawiian shirt or in my drink. i'd rather have that ash in the "ashtray".
but this last point about "ash" is just my own opinion. i know a lot of ppl "feel" that keeping the ash on there until it falls off on its own is a way to keep the cigar burning "cooler", which to me makes absolutley no sense at all. if the cherry is 3 inches from your mouth with 2 inch ash, when you draw, the smoke is still coming from that cherry that's 3 inches away. if you ash and have 1/4" ash and the cherry is still 3 inches away, uh... the smoke is still coming from a cherry that's 3 inches away, how would ash that isn't between the cherry and your mouth help "cool" it? never made sense to me.

as for looks... well, never judge a book by its cover. if i had some ugly cigars to send to you, i would.

alright, thanks again for the answers.

where in Jeff City? i went to a private school there for a year, can't remember the name, it was for 5th grade back in like '79 or '80. like st. josephs or something, had a round church.

Originally Posted by monte2

I understand most of the points being made here, especially about the look of the construction. If they can't even make the cigar look decent imagine what they used for tobacco. That being said I"ve never had a bad Henry Clay cigar, and they will never win a prize for beauty.

i agree about henry clay cigars, they're not half bad.

the underlined i don't understand the correlation. what does it matter how it looks if it smokes awesome and tastes even better?

[ca21455]

Originally Posted by IHT

where in Jeff City? i went to a private school there for a year, can't remember the name, it was for 5th grade back in like '79 or '80. like st. josephs or something, had a round church.

St. Josephs is correct.

My wife, two daughters and I moved to Holts Summit in 1981 (just north of JC) and then moved into Jefferson City in 1983. We lived in several houses in town and about a year ago built a house in a development just south of Jefferson City off of Tanner Bridge Road (still a Jeff City PO).