Are they worth it???

[SilvrBck]

I was perusing the T25 cigar rankings and noticed that the top 5 rated cigars are Padron 1964 & 1926. I also noted that the average price for these top 5 cigars was $16.52!!! The highest rated Cuban cigar came in at $12.73. I dunno guys. Is it worth it to spend $24 on a domestic smoke that I can only hope rivals the better Cuban cigars or should I just stick to the $5 Brazilias and Cuban cigars for less $$$? Seems like a no-brainer to me.

SB

[(909)]

Originally Posted by SilvrBck

I was perusing the T25 cigar rankings and noticed that the top 5 rated cigars are Padron 1964 & 1926. I also noted that the average price for these top 5 cigars was $16.52!!! The highest rated Cuban cigar came in at $12.73. I dunno guys. Is it worth it to spend $24 on a domestic smoke that I can only hope rivals the better Cuban cigars or should I just stick to the $5 Brazilias and Cuban cigars for less $$$?

While I really like the 64 and 26, for the price they are barely worth it. The Padrons are a different kind of smoke, the flavor is different from that of an ISOM but in it's own unique way very high quality. If Padron Anniversarys were $10.00 a stick, I would own a box.

With my limited experience, my opinion is that if you live somewhere where you can get the Cubans, that's were I would put my money.

[IHT]

Originally Posted by SilvrBck

I was perusing the T25 cigar rankings and noticed that the top 5 rated cigars are Padron 1964 & 1926. I also noted that the average price for these top 5 cigars was $16.52!!! The highest rated Cuban cigar came in at $12.73. I dunno guys. Is it worth it to spend $24 on a domestic smoke that I can only hope rivals the better Cuban cigars or should I just stick to the $5 Brazilias and Cuban cigars for less $$$? Seems like a no-brainer to me.

SB

i have some thoughts on this... the long story i've been wanting to write since i'm up late doing laundry in the hotel...

moki (as some of you know from here or other forums) is a big fan of padron and fuente, as they're good cigars. he and i got into a debate over on another forum, so he and someone else sent me a few very nice domestic cigars to try (and extras to let coppertop try as well).
http://www.cigarwise.net/forums/showthread.php?t=6401

i've had some padron 3000s, etc, and even the 64s, was NOT impressed one bit by either. actually, the 64's weren't bad, but not worth the $$$ you have to spend to buy one.

i had a very nice Opus X from 1999 that moki sent me that ranks as a tie or close 2nd for the best NON-CUBAN cigar i've ever had. i've also had a few other Opus X that were sent to me from him and from another nice guy (karanan), and to be brutally honest, they have blown chunks. i mean, no way in helium balloons would i ever chuck $10+ for another Opus X in my lifetime... and for how great they're rolled/construction, coppertop had one burn so bad that i could've been used to scoop ice cream with (i have the photo, just not uploaded).

we also had a Series 1926.... and if you click the link i provided, you can read about it, but all i can say is....
HEEEEEELLLLL NOOOOOOOO! i would NEVER buy one of those at all. talk about harsh... sure, it burned well, excellent draw, but tasted harsh, very harsh....

would "I" pay upwards of $15+ a cigar for an Opus (that you have to age just as long as a cuban - most people say - in order for it to taste good), or a high end Padron when i can easily get a cuban cigar of relatively same size for cheaper and have it taste better? sure, you might not have as many construction issues with the Padron or Fuente product, but it won't taste like your "average" cuban cigar.

and finally, i want to point something out about those top25 ratings....

not everyone who posts a review over there has had a good cuban cigar, a cigar that a very experienced cigar smoker would rank a 10.
how could you know that a padron 64 is a 9.5 when you dont' know there are BETTER cigars out there?
what i'm getting at is this: when i first started smoking cigars, i thought that a "5 Vegas" was pretty damn good. so, i would rank them pretty high over there, not knowing that, "hey, a HdM Epicure #2 is damn good!"
would i be able to go back and say, "well, now that i KNOW that this 5 Vegas should've only been ranked a 5 compared to what i rank a 10 now, can i change my ranking to reflect my eye opening experience?"

there's someone who posts on there a lot, i think it's "Rasputin", and in one of his rankings for a cuban cigar, he even makes that remark, that if he had known how good a good cuban cigar tastes, there would be no way he'd rank those Padron's a 10....

so, to me, those super high rankings that are given to Padrons and Opus', they should have an "*" next to them because some of those guys have not had your average cuban cigar, or a really good cuban cigar to show them just HOW GOOD a cigar can be.... compared to what we can legally buy in the states....

to use a different analogy:
if you're eating "swanson TV dinners" for most of your life, then all of the sudden you marry a great chef, those TV dinners just don't taste nearly as good as they used to, do they? HEEEEELLLL NO.

but that's just my point of view...
i've had to do a few essays in school and i always love to use the "CA" bullcrap cigar ratings and price guide to make sure that we americans think that domestic cigars are just as good as cubans, and a helluva lot cheaper.... but they're not.

i just had a very highly nasty Punch Gran Puro today (so did Coppertop) while we were walking down River Street in Savannah Georgia.... it cost us $8!! 8 x 25 = 200. so, i could find a buttload of cuban cigars for under 200 that would blow it away (maybe even a cabinet - like my '01 party shorts i just got a month ago).
take a standard domestic sancho panza that tastes adequate... it'll cost you nearly $5 a cigar...
this shop had a box of Padron 3000s for $166 a box!!??
i'd rather have any box of robusto/hermoso 4s from cuba for the same price, but that's just me...

[cyclops]

Originally Posted by IHT

so, i could find a buttload of cuban cigars for under 200 that would blow it away (maybe even a cabinet - like my '01 party shorts i just got a month ago).

A cab of Party Shorts for $200? Or did I read that wrong?

Anyway, if I were you and had access to Cubans, I'd stick with those definitely. And the Brazilias (what a smoke!). What am I saying? I have access to Cubans! I just have a college student's wallet! Good thing I'm starting this new job or I'd be SOL.

[Herfzilla]

I can find 64's for $13.00 locally if I look hard. They are good sticks, but I can get a couple nice habanos for that price.

[SeanGAR]

Originally Posted by cyclops

A cab of Party Shorts for $200? Or did I read that wrong?

Dang....did I miss a sale? I pay $229 for my party short cabs.

It is tough to justify paying $200+ for boxes of NCs when I know there are many nice habanos in the same price range that I like better. It is even more ridiculous when you look at stuff like the Padron '26s, where I can buy 3 or 4 nice boxes of habanos for the price of one box of 1926 No. 1 maduros. The padrons are well made cigars, no question about it, but they're just not worth the money and I'm not a huge fan of the taste, although I do smoke a lot of NCs.

I think the fact that habanos are not available in the US allows the crazy demand and high prices for high end NCs. If habanos were allowed to compete, the high end NCs would have to drop their prices to make sales, because when more US consumers try habanos, they more they'll want them. In fact I think if habanos were legal we'd be looking at a serious price increase due to supply and demand issues. I'm quite content with the current situation.

[Bman]

Well IMHO all the talk of cubans vs. domestics is like apples to oranges...as for price we seem to compare the price we pay for cubans that have no duties, import, federal, state or sin taxes on them.... as we know if they were taxed they would be at least double the price we pay....so price is apples to oranges. The smoking profile between the two is IMHO very different also...I think cubans build in intencenty of flavor and strenth as you smoke, domestics start stong, and flavorful but don't build to finish like a cuban...apples to oranges again...but it all comes down to what you like, if I like it enough I will pay the price. What's real stange for me is after I purchase a box I never think about how much they cost when I smoke'um...It all comes down to what you like and what your credit card balance is If I don't like a cigar I wouldn't buy them at half the price....Bman

[txmatt]

IHT your price comparison's aren't fair.

You are comparing mail order prices on the Cubans to very inflated retail prices on the domestically available. Is there a steep tobacco tax locally? Or perhaps you boght those cigars in a boobie bar?

You can get Punch Gran Puros for $80 - $90 on the Net (what size did you smoke, I hate the Pico Bonito but love the Rancho) This is less than half the $8 you paid.

You can get Padron 3000 for $72/box and 2000 for $60/box. $3 a cigar.

The $180 you quoted for the 3000 is enought to get the '64 Maduro Principe.

I haven't had a ISOM yet so perhaps they are just that much better.

I think '64 and '26 Padron's are better than the X000 line, and try to have a few of them in the coolerdor, but I can't justify buying them by the box when I can 3 boxes of 2000 for the price of one box of '26.. I judge many more expensive cigars by the Padron 2000.

Interesting you also mention Sancho Panza. I use the $2 Double Maduro Quixote as my standard for judging other cigars in that price range. Haven't run into anything until the Padron 2000 that I like better in low $$ cigars. Oliva bundles are one of the best cigars for around a buck, although I am starting to lean towards the Petit Bolivar Fuerte Maduro as my $1 favorite lately.

As to what you have noticed on the Opus X, what I understand is that they are much less acceptable of environmental fluctuations; if they aren't cared for very well they lose the special "thing" that they have. Of the 3 Opus X's that I have smoked I would have preferred a Don Carlos.

SB, if you like Brazilias you ought to also try an Italia.. I like them both but I have some Italias I am aging

Matt

[IHT]

Originally Posted by cyclops

A cab of Party Shorts for $200? Or did I read that wrong?

well, that was last month when a site ran a promotion for 15% off cabinets of 50. so, you figure around 210 or so, minus the 15% off would equal in the 190s....

i'm waiting for the next time so i can order a cab of HdM Epi 2's.

[cyclops]

Originally Posted by IHT

well, that was last month when a site ran a promotion for 15% off cabinets of 50. so, you figure around 210 or so, minus the 15% off would equal in the 190s....

i'm waiting for the next time so i can order a cab of HdM Epi 2's.

Aha. I need to keep my eyes peeled for those promotions, then.

[IHT]

Originally Posted by txmatt

IHT your price comparison's aren't fair.
IHT - i agree, it wasn't fair. those are "in store" prices at a shop on the riverwalk in downtown Savannah (not a boobie-bar). so i'm guilty of "reverse CA-ism".

You are comparing mail order prices on the Cubans to very inflated retail prices on the domestically available. Is there a steep tobacco tax locally? Or perhaps you boght those cigars in a boobie bar?
IHT - true, as the first paragraph points out. so i am wrong on that part. the 2nd question: NO, not a steep tax locally, as other cigars were abour right on in price that we've seen all over the nation when we travel. 3rd question: not in a boobie bar.

You can get Punch Gran Puros for $80 - $90 on the Net (what size did you smoke, I hate the Pico Bonito but love the Rancho) This is less than half the $8 you paid.
IHT - we had the Rancho, rather large cigar, about 6" x 52 ring or bigger. was not very good, made me want to spit all the time, and the guiness i was drinking didn't help like it normally does. it also suffered from a poor roll, as coppertop could attest to. but i'm not trying to argue the punch gran puro cigar itself, more the price of one of them compared to a similarly priced cuban cigar.

You can get Padron 3000 for $72/box and 2000 for $60/box. $3 a cigar.
IHT - i agree, you can get them off c-bid as well for pretty cheap. i know it's retail prices i was looking at, but since i've been out of town for 3 weeks, with 2 more to go, i didn't bring any cigars of my own with me... no way i would buy a box of those for as much as they wanted.

The $180 you quoted for the 3000 is enought to get the '64 Maduro Principe.
IHT - which i've had and were not bad at all.

I haven't had a ISOM yet so perhaps they are just that much better.
IHT - yes, they are.

I think '64 and '26 Padron's are better than the X000 line, and try to have a few of them in the coolerdor, but I can't justify buying them by the box when I can 3 boxes of 2000 for the price of one box of '26.. I judge many more expensive cigars by the Padron 2000.
IHT - i've had no problems with the standard X000 lines of Padrons, i still have one here to smoke that i picked up.

Interesting you also mention Sancho Panza. I use the $2 Double Maduro Quixote as my standard for judging other cigars in that price range. Haven't run into anything until the Padron 2000 that I like better in low $$ cigars. Oliva bundles are one of the best cigars for around a buck, although I am starting to lean towards the Petit Bolivar Fuerte Maduro as my $1 favorite lately.
IHT - i like to compare other domestic cigars to one of my favorites, the Trilogy Authentic Corojo... it doesn't matter how much a cigar costs, really, as long as you like it. but when people can buy a better cigar for cheaper, why would they NOT do that?

As to what you have noticed on the Opus X, what I understand is that they are much less acceptable of environmental fluctuations; if they aren't cared for very well they lose the special "thing" that they have. Of the 3 Opus X's that I have smoked I would have preferred a Don Carlos.
Matt

comments are in the quote...

[megasolo]

Are they worth it??? You make it sound so simple, just go out and try a cuban, you'll never rate cigars the same again. I have to say yes they are. Cubans are too hard to get, too expensive (i say expensive,because i can go buy a single padron anni, but i cant go buy a single cuban cigar), and quite frankly there risky. You have to worry about fakes, if you order through the mail, you have to worry about them getting seized. There are just too many variables
I've been smoking cigars for three years now and have never had a cuban. So put the "***" next to my rankings, I'm ok with that. as long as cubans are impossible to get, my rankings will continue to be high for the padron anni's.

[kansashat]

I've been thinking about dropping $170 on a box of Principes. I have never had a PAN or PAM. I have, however, smoked a few Cuban cigars. They do have a distinctive flavor & aroma, but they haven't ruined me on the non-isom smokes.
There are many good DR, Honduran, Nicaraguan, even Brazilian cigars out there. I believe the non-Cuban cigar manufacturers have to try harder, so they experiment more, age more, take greater care & pride in construction, etc.
I believe the Cuban expatriot cigar makers deserve our support & I will continue to give it to them.

P.S. I am not implying that it is unpatriotic to smoke a Cuban cigar.

[IHT]

let me re-explain my answers...
are they worth it?

to me, that is asking if they taste good enough to warrant paying out the nose for ultra hard to find cigars that are way overpriced. HELL NO, they are not worth it. are some of them good? yes, some of them are good. the ultra hard to find padron 1926 that i had (only had it because it was sent in a package - i would never pay $20 for 1 single cigar) was not even close to being good enough for me to spend $10 on it just to see if i'd like it. i have had a handful or more of the padron Anniv 1964s, and they, i thought, were actually better than the 1 single 1926.
i've now had a few (4 or so) Opus X, of different sizes and ages. 1 of them was great, the others were no better than a cheap bundle cigar you can get from C-bid.com....

now, worth it? once again, i'm reading into the question as asking, "does the enjoyment/flavor/overall experience of these hard to find/expensive cigars merit purchasing them at those prices?"
my simple answer is: no.

why? because you can find even some NON-CUBANS that are equal to them in flavor and about half the price or so...

if you guys STILL can't figure out what i'm saying, i'm sorry, i can't explain it any more. if you haven't had a good cuban cigar, i'm sorry, some of us take that chance and are happy with the returns we get. and most hard to find cuban cigars are still easier to find, and cheaper, than the most exotic non-cubans that are nearly impossible to buy, or so i've found in my own limited experiences.

oh, i'm not a cuban only snob smoker, so don't read into like that. i'm not anywhere near an experienced cigar smoker, but i know what i have experienced myself, and that's what i'm basing my answers by. if you all disagree, that's cool with me, i'm not here to agree with everyone, i'm here to discuss things.

[Lamar]

I must admit that I prefer isom's mostly because of price and long term aging potential but out of fairness, I bought my first 1926 today at $30. Price is working against me fully enjoying this cigar though because it is going to have to be some kind of good to outperform the 7 Party Shorts that I could have had instead.