Disconnect in cigar ratings?

[Boston_Dude05]

Just curious, is there some kind of disconnect in ratings or are these threads self-selecting? My question is based on the fact that some cigars have such a loyal following, but yet their Top25 rating is lower than expected. For example, Ashton VSGs seem to have many fans (of which I am also) and also the La Flor Double Ligero line, but the ratings on these are no higher than mid-8s at best. The Padron '64s and '26s are consistent in that they have a high ratings and also many fans on these boards.

How can this disconnect occur? I am curious since sometimes I buy based on ratings and also what other BOTLs post and am sometimes confused by the disconnect.

One theory I had was that on Top25 there is a rating for "value", but I dismissed this after considering the LFD Double Chisel is a pretty good value at a few bucks per stick, yet still had a rating discrepency between Top25 and these threads. Another one could be that there is a positive bias on the threads in the sense that more positive thoughts come out on cigars than negative. Thoughts?

[deslni01]

I'm not entirely sure how the ratings are done with top25, but perhaps it's just a personal taste between the few raters on the website.

For example, I may enjoy something tremendously but it may not be something a lot of others enjoy. I would give it a 95 for example, but not a lot of people would smoke them.

And on the contrary, I may not like it as much as "cigar x", but the majority of people may.

I dunno, just my theory

[nismo350z]

Yea you can only get a slight idea from some of these ratings it seems and i try to find a consensus. CA for example rated the Ashton Heritage an 85, which is pretty low but yet i really enjoy that stick so it all depends i guess on each individuals taste. Im also a big fan of the VSG

[inept]

I'd say that the difference between 8 and 9 is subjective to the point of being irrelevant. 8 is near excellence in my eyes. The difference between a true (i.e. many ratings instead of just one guy's rating) 5 and 8, though, is probably astronomical. I don't use Top 25 to determine whether cigar A is better than cigar B because that's up to me. I use it to determine whether cigar X is worth trying at all.

I base my conclusions on a combination of rating and price as opposed to just looking at the ratings. I've tried some great sixes.

One thing I've noticed is that people tend to rate maduros higher than naturals on Top 25 and I know that I always go the other way. I prefer naturals so If I see a stick whose maduro variant is an 8 and whose natural variant is a 6, I just swap the ratings around.

I also tend to ignore all ratings on non-Cuban Cubans because I find that the ratings are unusually skewed. I can't help but chuckle when I see a Dominican/Honduran equivalent that I have tried trailing the Cuban original by just a few tenths because in my experience they aren't even shades of the original. The 1-point difference between a Cuban and its Dominican/Honduran counterpart is much wider than the 1-point difference between two totally unrelated cigars of which neither has anything to do with Cuba at all. That doesn't mean that there aren't fine cigars (Excalibur!) to be had in this "category," just that the relative ratings may be a little funky.

[Warhorse545]

I used to look at the ratings and try and buy from what I read and seen. But after time and a lot of disapointing cigars ( inset opus x here ) I have found that I just smoke what I like based on what I hear from fellow cigar smokers and not mags or web sites. Ratings at this point do not mean a heck of a lot to me. I either like the cigar, love the cigar, really really like the cigar, can stand to smoke it once in a while or aint going to smoke one ever again. It is all subjective. You like what you like. Who cares who thinks it is a good bad or ugly cigar? Nice to read about and hear about and discuss, but bottom line is to to smoke what ya like and not sweat what others think on the cigar.


Stacey

[carni]

I would say cigar ratings is all personal preference. If you value one aspect more than the next guy then your ratings will be totally different. The good thing about reading other ratings is picking out the parts that interest you or steer you away from that cigar.

[LasciviousXXX]

My take on it has always been that Top25Cigar is MUCH bigger and more well known than CS so the people that contribute ratings to Top25 are more diverse and could possibly be less experienced than most here on CS. Thus to them a Torano 59 Silver is "The best cigar they've ever had" where most people on CS have the experience to know that while that smoke is good, there are so many more that deserve higher ratings.

Even though CS is one of the larger Cigar boards out there you have to realize that CS is made up of the small minority of Cigar Smokers who actually view Cigars and Cigar smoking as more than just a casual hobby. Thus we are going to do more research, smoke a broader range of smokes, and generally just take it more seriously than the average Joe who walks into his B&M every other week looking for something relaxing.

So I guess really the point is that CS is the Cream of the Crop and we really do our research into what we like and what we don't. Therein lies why the ratings might be different from the popular opinion held by most CS members.

[Hydrated]

I totally ignore CA ratings... they are so skewed by advertising dollars that they become totally useless. C'mon... you could put the crappiest cigar in the world up there and CA would give it an 80 rating in the hopes that the manufacturer will buy ad space later. Another problem is that a cigar's availability evaporates as soon as it gets a good rating from CA. Give an average cigar a 90 in CA, and you can't find that stick for 6 months... even if it isn't really THAT good.

I read the reviews on top25.com to get an idea of a cigar's general personality before I buy. But I only use it as a tool to spot obvious trends in cigars. I look to see if nearly every review talks about how strong a cigar is... or how smooth the stick smokes... things like that. And I like the fact that top25 is all posted by regular guys like me who don't necessarily taste chocolate and nutmeg based earthiness in every cigar that they light up...

Bobby

[pnoon]

Originally Posted by LasciviousXXX

So I guess really the point is that CS is the Cream of the Crop and we really do our research into what we like and what we don't. Therein lies why the ratings might be different from the popular opinion held by most CS members.

Have to disagree with ya, Dustin.

First - CS being the "Cream of the Crop" smells like 7 year old Madagascar vanilla. Yes we do our research more than most but to imply that we (as a group) are superior sounds a bit pretentious to me.

Second - I think the reason the ratings are different is that the majority of reviewers on Top25 are NOT CS members. Regardless of the maturity of their cigar knowledge, that alone would explain Top25 results differing from CS.

Just my

[Hydrated]

Originally Posted by LasciviousXXX

So I guess really the point is that CS is the Cream of the Crop ...

Thanks Dustin! We love you too!

[LasciviousXXX]

Originally Posted by pnoon

Have to disagree with ya, Dustin.

First - CS being the "Cream of the Crop" smells like 7 year old Madagascar vanilla. Yes we do our research more than most but to imply that we (as a group) are superior sounds a bit pretentious to me.

That's cool Peter, I guess maybe what I was trying to say just came out wrong.

Wasn't trying to imply that we at CS are superior, only that most of the people who choose to post on CS long-term will have more experience with a multitude of different styles of smokes than your average Joe cigar smoker. That doesn't make us any better or worse, it just makes our ratings a little different then the guy who thinks his Fuente Curly head is the greatest thing since sliced bread LOL.

[discdog]

I tend to scour the review archieves of a couple of different places and pick out someone doing reviews that has the same taste preference that I do. Then, when something new comes out, if I haven't tried it yet, I look for reviews from those individuals. This process has been accurate for me about 90% of the time. Just goes to show, not everyones taste is alike, so smoke what you like.

[Pablo]

Owning and creating both sites, maybe I can shed a little light on this.

First, the reviews at top25cigar.com come from a much larger pool of reviewers than here at CS, or really anywhere for that matter. Top25Cigar is intended to be a compilation of all the smoking publics thoughts on a cigar, and does not differentiate from someone smoking their first cigar to someone smoking their 10,000th. All reviews have the same value.

I think the "average" palate of CS members is more experienced than T25C contributors...just due to the sheer volume at T25C.

Lastly, anyone trying to make sense out of personal opinions is going to get frustrated. You will never agree with everyone, and your favorite cigar may not be someone else's.

T25C was developed to display an average public opinion of a smoke, and really came to be in response to the reviews at CA that are so heavily influenced by advertising dollars, and a minimal sampling base...sometimes as small as one or two editors.

[madurolover]

I will look at Top25 just to get a basis for a cigar.
Pretty much if 3/4ths of the reviewers see it one way then there is a good chance that is the way it is.
I also look to see if any fellow gorillas have reviewed something because I kinda know what some peoples taste is like.

[LasciviousXXX]

Originally Posted by pds

I think the "average" palate of CS members is more experienced than T25C contributors...just due to the sheer volume at T25C.

Man THAT'S what I was trying to say... just not doing to well at it. Thanks Paul