How the Dutch take care of problems...

[God]

It's hard to understand this logic...

http://www.expatica.com/source/site_...unding+junkies

[Redman]

All I can say is geeezz. Where do you even start one that one? Glad to be here i the good ole US of A!

[Scott M]

"An addict who is not being treated would need rob, shop lift or burgle EUR 1,000 a day. A lot of people are saved from becoming victims of such crimes every day because addicts who are in the treatment programme hardly ever commit further crimes," Van der Laan said.

Yeah..that makes sense.... to the proctologist looking for their friggin heads. Just how does their govt. get the money to pay not only for the drugs but for the associated medical costs of addiction...oh, yeah...in the form of some pretty outrageous taxes, i.e. robbing and burgling.


AFAIC, that dog don't hunt.


Scott"whataretheythinking?"M

[Churchlady]

Interesting, isn't it? I have friends who spent a year in the netherlands and were fascintated by this. They say it does work, because, it doesn't really entice people to use the drug since they don't give it to first time "wanna be addicts", that the people who are addicts would have been addicts anyways, so it does save on petty crimes.

I'm not sure, that logic would work here, but it seems to work there.

[SeanGAR]

The American drug laws are a horrible joke, costing taxpayers ~ 20 billion/year, depriving ~300,000 citizens of liberty, and resulting in increased corruption and violent crime. I can hardly see this Dutch experiment as being worse.

http://www.wfu.edu/users/pangmr3/mys...ar%20notes.doc

[Jeff]

Living over 3000 miles from the Netherlands, I don't know if this tactic is working for them. However, I sure as hell know that the way the USA is handling our drug problem isn't effective. Lets keep an open mind at least.

[DrStrangelove]

I wrote this last night at 3am but then the forums went down. Anyway, here goes -

God, this is not a new idea. Throughout the 19th century the thought of 'drug addiction' was virtually non-existent. Hell, everyone from Freud to Baseball players to Sherlock Homes regularly consumed cocaine. Cocaine and Morphine were sold over the counter and drug related crime was non-existent (yes, in the US too). In 1914 (I'm not 100% sure on the date but if I'm wrong, I'm not far off) many of the substances we today consider 'hard drugs' were legislated against. Caffeine was originally on the list but cocaine was chosen instead, entirely for political reasons. Southern senators wanted more firepower to use against black laborers who were often given cocaine by their employers so they could work harder and longer hours. "Cocaine crazed negro" was a regular headline in the papers at the turn of the century. Before cocaine and morphine (heroin) were made illegal, a huge percentage of the population used the drugs regularly (I can't give you a statistic off the top of my head, but believe me, it was higher than all of us would imagine).

When the drugs were made illegal a lot of otherwise normal, working people suddenly became criminals. They could no longer get their 'medicine' from pharmacies and were forced into the underworld. Cocaine and Heroin attics couldn't get jobs, and yes, crime rates increased. Today many think of the DEA and 'War and Drugs' as economic enterprises. Our tax dollars pay for thousands of people to try and stop the use of illegal drugs, but regardless, millions of Americans consume them. When these people are caught in possession of drugs they are thrown in jail as criminals when really they are ill, now our tax dollars are paying to keep junkies in cages instead of trying to get them off the smack. I've known a number of otherwise good people who had serious drug problems. Yeah, maybe they committed crimes, stole radios, or broke into houses to pay for their addiction. If these drugs were readily available to them and they weren’t ******* by the majority of society, it's probable that they wouldn't have had to break the law to feed their habit; maybe they could work a normal job and get their fix legally. That's what a lot of people don't realize - the US Government is what is creating artificially high drug prices and a market so out of hand (and to many, seemingly unavoidable) that people have to break the law to buy in. You don't have to agree with what I'm saying, you don't have to disagree with what I'm saying, but at least consider it as food for thought.

This is what the Dutch are trying to fix. Give junkies heroin, that way they won't have to mug people and rob houses to pay for their habits. It's a pretty simple concept. Maybe they're right, maybe they're not. Heroin use is a lot higher in the Netherlands than here partly because there is not the same stigma and barrage of sheer propaganda that there is in the states surrounding drug use in general. I'm not saying that doing drugs is right, or even OK, but the idea that it's not is a relatively new one, even in the USofA. Either way, it's something that as we can see no amount of money or manpower can stop and because it has been made illegal, it's spawning crime.

I don't like drug use, and I don't know if re-legalization or heroin handouts are the right answer, but I think the route that we've been taking for the last 100 years (and more vigorously in the last 35) has been costly and utterly ineffective. I don't know that the Dutch way is the right way, but they can definitely make a strong argument for what they're trying to do. With problems that seriously afflict the lives of so many: drug users, the victims of crime, and every taxpayer who is funding a failing campaign against drugs, its not a bad idea to try and play all of the angles. Its hard to hit a bulls eye with your eyes closed.

[kansashat]

huffhuffhuffhuffhuffhuff........

I just got in (huffhuffhuffhuff....) from burgling my neighbor's house to buy (huffhuffhuff....) cigars. Man! That TV was heavy!

[DrStrangelove]

Originally Posted by kansashat

huffhuffhuffhuffhuffhuff........

I just got in (huffhuffhuffhuff....) from burgling my neighbor's house to buy (huffhuffhuff....) cigars. Man! That TV was heavy!

see, if the government had just gone ahead and paid for your habanos instead of paying customs agents to keep the stogies out of the country this injustics would have never occured!

[God]

Originally Posted by DrStrangelove

see, if the government had just gone ahead and paid for your habanos instead of paying customs agents to keep the stogies out of the country this injustics would have never occured!

I'm a little short on cash this week... if the government would just give me some extra money I won't have to rob a bank..

Short term gain... (I don't know how long this Dutch "experiment" has been in place but a few years is a very short time in the overall life of cultures) is often seen as a solution without consideration of long term effects.

I agree with several other postings in this thread that our system of drug prevention, rehabilitation and prosecution are not working. Solutions to these problems are complex and involve action that is not politically correct at this jucture in time...

[JustAyoungMC]

Originally Posted by DrStrangelove

That's what a lot of people don't realize - the US Government is what is creating artificially high drug prices and a market so out of hand (and to many, seemingly unavoidable) that people have to break the law to buy in.

The government has finally done what alchemist have dreamed of: turned a weed into gold.