How do you think Cuba gets fixed?

[Addiction]

This question rattles around my mind a bit because we as Americans first and cigar smokers second seem more than ready to stand in judgement of Cuba. But I'm curious as to what we think the answer is in that country?

I personally have no idea, I don't think its simple as everyone gets a vote and things get better. Everyone here has had a vote for a while now and it has not exactly solved all the problems oppression created in our country.

[shilala]

I'm lodged in the "Live and Let Live" corner.
Being uninformed on all things Cuba, I'd like to think out government has all the info necessary to consider or reconsider the embargo (Yes, I understand that's most likely a joke). I imagine things stand as they are because no one wants to lift a finger to effect the change and undo all the years of embargo.
It's much easier to let things stand pat.
So, my thoughts on it boil down to mere laziness. I fail to see what good we're doing with the policy, and I honestly think that if we had interaction with the Cuban populace that any poor feelings from the past would evaporate in minutes.
I get the impression that they are damn fine people and that we'd be far better off having them in our "family".

[pcozad1]

It will take a revolution by the cuban people again. Pat

[taltos]

A good start even before installing another form of government would be to start talks on reparations to the families whose industries were nationalized. This would begin to show good faith on the part of the Cuban government. A release of political prisoners and an accounting of those murdered by the Cuban government would also help.

[krisko]

Let's imagine for a moment that things aren't all that terrible in Cuba. Everyone gets an education and a job, it wasn't always like that in Cuba. I'm no closet socialist mind you, but it seems to be working in Cuba. As Americans we like to think we have the best system of government and socials structure but that just isn't the case. Perhaps it's better to say that America functions best as a republic and the citizens of other countries are free to pursue the government structure of their choice. Make no mistake, every citizen of the world has a choice. Even in places are opressive as China and Cuba.

The perceived 'problem' in Cuba is not an American issue. It's a Cuban issue if there even is an issue. I would like to see the US lift the embargo and trade freely with Cuba as we do the rest of the hemisphere. It certainly wouldn't harm either Cuba or the US and it would likely do some good. As Cubans meet and trade with Americans, they'll start to wonder why they don't enjoy some of the freedoms that we have. Over time they'll begin to demand them, or not perhaps. They might be very content with how things are structured over there.

My ...I hardly have all the answers.

[rrplasencia]

There are too many people here that were directly affected by Cuba. I still remember the stories of my grandparents and parents being forced to leave cuba leavng everything behind, and then being seperated and sent to whatever city the gov decided they should go to. In their case KC. That was early 60's. I have cooks that work for me, it took one 3 months of jumping from country to country. He finally made it to mexico were he and his pregnant wife crossed the river. And my pastry girl and her family tried the old fashioned raft method 3 times, 12 people on a raft incuding kids. The first 2 they were taken back and all imprisoned each time and they still tried a 3rd time. What must things be like that you would put your family in that danger for a chance at something better. They all love their homeland but can't live in a place were the police could take you away for any reason they feel like that day. Many feel that way and many have come into positions of power including senate and house positions. And those make sure the others voices are heard. If the current "leadership" situation changed they would all love to go back and visit their familes, as i would like to go see were mine came from. i've only been as far as g-mo on a submarine. Sorry that was like .

[DonnieW]

Originally Posted by taltos

A good start even before installing another form of government would be to start talks on reparations to the families whose industries were nationalized. This would begin to show good faith on the part of the Cuban government. A release of political prisoners and an accounting of those murdered by the Cuban government would also help.

I agree. They could essentially follow what Nicaragua has done. While not the smoothest transition, they did make (some) reparations to families and private business owners. Gaining the trust of the people is the most difficult part. You can't "fix" anything unless there is a degree of trust in the government.

[ZedR2]

I have been to Cuba and the people are very nice to both Canadians & Americans that sneak in , yes they drive over from Buffalo and fly out of Toronto ...
And yes Cubans invite Americans with a warm welcome !
If you could only see the kids that are hurting so much over this embargo , when I go I bring candy , a few T-shirts and lots of Bic Pens that I buy for a dollar for a pack of like 50 and hand them out to the children , they just think the world of you for that , I had one kid who wanted a pen and I didn't have anymore except one of my own good pens and I thought 'what the hell' so I gave it to the kid , well I go back 2 years later and I see the same kid and he yells out 'Senor Canadian , I still have your pen , it works so wonderful Thank You ' , 2 years later ...
I wish the US would put a stop to this embargo as all you have to do is take a look at the rest of the world and there are allot worse out there than Cuba but your politicians come voting time only worry about abortion and Religion , like mentioned above they could care less about Cuba and it's a Damn shame , beautiful country and friendly people that will go out of their way to do anything for you once you get to know them and that's the hard part , we are basically living the life of luxury and they live in squander ..
I didn't realize it but on a bus trip to old Havana you will never see an over weight Cuban and then when I watched the DVD video of the trip there I see all these fat bellied Canadians & Americans get off the bus and it hit me like a ton of bricks , no MacDonalds there , hell you can't even buy a bag of chips because they don't exist ...
Damn Shame , only if you the people would speak up it would end !

[krisko]

Originally Posted by ZedR2

If you could only see the kids that are hurting so much over this embargo , when I go I bring candy , a few T-shirts and lots of Bic Pens that I buy for a dollar for a pack of like 50 and hand them out to the children , they just think the world of you for that , I had one kid who wanted a pen and I didn't have anymore except one of my own good pens and I thought 'what the hell' so I gave it to the kid , well I go back 2 years later and I see the same kid and he yells out 'Senor Canadian , I still have your pen , it works so wonderful Thank You ' , 2 years later ...
I wish the US would put a stop to this embargo as all you have to do is take a look at the rest of the world and there are allot worse out there than Cuba but your politicians come voting time only worry about abortion and Religion , like mentioned above they could care less about Cuba and it's a Damn shame , beautiful country and friendly people that will go out of their way to do anything for you once you get to know them and that's the hard part , we are basically living the life of luxury and they live in squander ..

Nice story and admirable generosity.

There is no doubt that the embargo is more about the Cubans in Miami than the Cubans in Havana. Lifting the embargo would be the most logical thing a president can do but it would be political suicide. Florida has never counted more than it did in 2000 and in 2008. A candidate would probably lose Florida if they proposed lifting the embargo. Unfortunately, the people of Cuba are losers in this debate.

[Volt]

Well, for me... I have never been in favor of nation building or being the world's police. Unless a country's actions are in direct conlfict with the US (Cuban Missle Crisis) we need to keep our collective noses out of others affairs. Just because we are the biggest doesn't we need to insert our ideas and morals on others.

A tad old fashioned - prolly. We have enough issues at home we need to fix. Isreal/PLO/Hamas - let them keep taking each other out..... When they get tired of it and are ready to sit down they will. No amout of external pressure has ever worked there with real results cuz they aren't really ready to get it fixed. Etc...

This part gets offensive.... If a group of people are truly tired of the govt/regime they have - revolt. Regardless as to the numbers in the military/police if your willing to go the distance there are more of you than them. 20 years in service along with my up bringing has proven to me I have a country worth dying for. Not necessasarily for some BS King George (BTW I did vote for him in case your wondering) has gotten us involved in overseas, but the defense of my country. Others in other countries need to acess their own situation and handle it.

Damn, I'm hungry and should answered after lunch.... Regardless, as much as I hate to say it came from Hollywood. A line from the Untouchables that Sean Connery stated to Kevin Costner.... What are you willing to do? Basically, what are you willing to do, what actions will you take to correct what you perceive as a problem? A lot of peeps like to type and whine, what are you willing to do. One way I try to participate, I have both Senators and my Congessman in my email adress book. All 3 get a quarterly email on my thoughts and concerns as to their voting. 2 of the three no longer send form letters, I get a individualized letter with their comments.

[Addiction]

Originally Posted by taltos

A good start even before installing another form of government would be to start talks on reparations to the families whose industries were nationalized. This would begin to show good faith on the part of the Cuban government. A release of political prisoners and an accounting of those murdered by the Cuban government would also help.

Thinking about this is part of what got me starting this thread. I mean as a member of a free thinking society the first thing that comes to mind to me is repairations. Then I considered that I am, and am very proud to be, an American. And our entire way of life is built on the backs of the red, black, brown, yellow and various anglo european people that we exploited to build this country. Heck we are so good at exploitation via outsourcing we've found ways to exploit people without even invading them!

Is it right, would it be right, for us as Americans to demand that Cuba actually make fiscal repairations?

[Addiction]

Originally Posted by Volt

Well, for me... I have never been in favor of nation building or being the world's police. Unless a country's actions are in direct conlfict with the US (Cuban Missle Crisis) we need to keep our collective noses out of others affairs. Just because we are the biggest doesn't we need to insert our ideas and morals on others.

A tad old fashioned - prolly. We have enough issues at home we need to fix. Isreal/PLO/Hamas - let them keep taking each other out..... When they get tired of it and are ready to sit down they will. No amout of external pressure has ever worked there with real results cuz they aren't really ready to get it fixed. Etc...

This part gets offensive.... If a group of people are truly tired of the govt/regime they have - revolt. Regardless as to the numbers in the military/police if your willing to go the distance there are more of you than them. 20 years in service along with my up bringing has proven to me I have a country worth dying for. Not necessasarily for some BS King George (BTW I did vote for him in case your wondering) has gotten us involved in overseas, but the defense of my country. Others in other countries need to acess their own situation and handle it.

Damn, I'm hungry and should answered after lunch.... Regardless, as much as I hate to say it came from Hollywood. A line from the Untouchables that Sean Connery stated to Kevin Costner.... What are you willing to do? Basically, what are you willing to do, what actions will you take to correct what you perceive as a problem? A lot of peeps like to type and whine, what are you willing to do. One way I try to participate, I have both Senators and my Congessman in my email adress book. All 3 get a quarterly email on my thoughts and concerns as to their voting. 2 of the three no longer send form letters, I get a individualized letter with their comments.

Mentally right there with you in some ways. I think as a nation we are much stronger when we mind our own business. Hell hungry people in India, there are hungry people right here on 16th and K. My mom always said sweep around your own front door before you point out the mess of others.

However I sometimes wonder if we are poorer as people if we don't get involved.

In any event I think the embargo represents us being in Cuba's business. Heck we buy plenty of lead based toys from the Chinese and they last I checked they are pretty communist.

[rrplasencia]

Originally Posted by Addiction

In any event I think the embargo represents us being in Cuba's business. Heck we buy plenty of lead based toys from the Chinese and they last I checked they are pretty communist.

do you have any idea how long it took me to find a thomas the train (toy) that was made in taiwan? 1 out of a 100 trains, the chinese almost destroyed Christmas. sorry a little off subject.

[McCharlie]

I say as long as Cuba supports attemps to overthrow our allies in the region the embargo should stay. The Castros are nothing but tyrants and should be challenged at every turn from expanding their control over people.

[MarbleApe]

Just a thought, but with the rest of the world freely trading with Cuba, arn't the Cuban people still suffering? I mean isn't it up to the rest of the world to help fix Cuba? Is it only because of the Embargo that the people are made to suffer? Of course this sounds callus coming from a "fat American", but if the Cuban government in power doesn't see themselves as broken, why is it looked at solely as America's problem/responsability to save them? If we use force (war) we are the bad guys. If we use leverage (embargo) we are the bad guys. If we mind our own business (Nationalism) we are the bad guys.

To date, the govenment in power over Cuba is not asking anyone to help "fix" anything.

I love cigars as much at the next BOTL, but not at the expense, safety, or love of my own country.