So, Reggie's in trouble

[preludese111]

So, Reggie Bush is in bad shape right now. It looks like he and his family received about 280 thousand total while at Southern California from an "investor." You guys think they'll take the national title away? I don't think the idea that SC didn't know about it is bogus. They knew he was very poor and his dad was given money for a house and Reggie got a car. They say they'll make sanctions against SC, but we'll see to what extent. Thoughts?

[moon]

I have alot of views on college athletics. This kid played his heart out for the team and his skills have proven themself at the next level. As much as I hate how much pro athletes are making and how arogant they are. Look at how much these Univeristies at the college level are pulling in because of the student athletes. I think I read the top 15 or so bowl teams were entilted to 17 million per school. I realize these kids are getting full rides and have to learn to respect and abide by rules and I appreciate that. Reggie Bush did nothing wrong though and if he comes form a family that cannot afford to see him play in key games and he is a reason for crowd attendace and revenue for the school, his parents deserve to be there to see him play. I used to work with a NFL players Dad and he told me his son recieved "gifts" and "help" from agents interested in him. He has not turned into a Reggie Bush as far as talent so the spot light is not on him but all the same when you boil it down. I am a Buc's fan and should hate the Saints but Reggie Bush seems to me like one of the good guys. Some one who will make you think better of the league. If he got some help along the way and turns it into positive for someone else, which I think from what I have seen from him so far he will. Where was the harm done. I have a little buzz so don't hate on the lack of fact. "This is opinion and I will respect yours". Also by absolutly no means am I a Reggie Bush, Saints, or SC fan. But at the same time think it is water under the bridge.

[hornitosmonster]

I like Reggie Bush. If the Saints don't want him (Kidding of course) ship him to Dallas. Can you imagine the temptation he was under as a poor kid being offered the World. I'm not saying it was right..just saying it had to be a tough situation.

Originally Posted by moon

I have alot of views on college athletics. This kid played his heart out for the team and his skills have proven themself at the next level. As much as I hate how much pro athletes are making and how arogant they are. Look at how much these Univeristies at the college level are pulling in because of the student athletes. I think I read the top 15 or so bowl teams were entilted to 17 million per school. I realize these kids are getting full rides and have to learn to respect and abide by rules and I appreciate that. Reggie Bush did nothing wrong though and if he comes form a family that cannot afford to see him play in key games and he is a reason for crowd attendace and revenue for the school, his parents deserve to be there to see him play. I used to work with a NFL players Dad and he told me his son recieved "gifts" and "help" from agents interested in him. He has not turned into a Reggie Bush as far as talent so the spot light is not on him but all the same when you boil it down. I am a Buc's fan and should hate the Saints but Reggie Bush seems to me like one of the good guys. Some one who will make you think better of the league. If he got some help along the way and turns it into positive for someone else, which I think from what I have seen from him so far he will. Where was the harm done. I have a little buzz so don't hate on the lack of fact. "This is opinion and I will respect yours". Also by absolutly no means am I a Reggie Bush, Saints, or SC fan. But at the same time think it is water under the bridge.

This position would hold water with the NCAA, except, when you look at the severe sanctions against Alabama for a violation involving a potential recruit (who DID NOT come to play for Bama, and who DID NOT gain financially from the violation, and involved a single booster that gave money to the player's high school coach to try and direct the player to Alabama.)

In Reggie's case, the money and benefits flowed DIRECTLY to him and/or his family, while he was on the field for the college team that will have to defend itself against sanctions that proportionally SHOULD be more severe than Alabama (But most probably will be only a fraction of that given to Bama).

The interesting thing to watch here is the severity of the final sanctions handed down. Given the amount of money and the direct relationships involved, they should be severe. If not (which I suspect will be the case), then we have a case of USC either giving a huge "donation" to the NCAA (or officials within the NCAA), or a case of turning a blind eye.

I do not defend what the Bama booster did. It was WRONG. What the USC boosters did is just as WRONG under the NCAA rules. Are these the only two teams where this has happened? NO!! Is this now over, and nobody else is doing it anymore?? NO!!! Will this go away in the future because boosters will suddenly stop this behavior??? NO!!!

What the whole crappola boils down to is this: Either everyone tighten up on their boosters and student athletes, or lets quit fooling ourselves, and design a payment system to compensate these supposed amateurs. But then again, wouldn't such a system then become full of corruption and inequities? Kind of a situation where they are "damned if they do, damned if they don't". Given the potential for "legal" payment corruption, mis-management and probably cries of inequity in amounts paid and to whom paid, I would have to think that such as system might be worse than what we already have!!

So, is the cure worse than the disease?? IMO, I think probably so, in the long run.

[preludese111]

^^^Well put. I think that there is no system in any aspect of life that is perfect, so the one they have is about as good as it will get, probably. I just think it will be hard to judge what should be done to punish all involved because obviously Bush was a critical part of their team and probably drove the team to success in many aspects, and he was technically ineligable, so do they strip games? Do they take the national title? Regardless, it looks like USC's going to lose a bit of money. They deserve it though. I hate their program; their players showed little class in the game against Michigan and the program takes the goal of profit to a different level. Many students are lucky to get to go to games, as the system is that of a lottery setup for students, so they can sell expensive tickets, rather than give them away to the kids that freaking go there. I think that's retarded and I'd be pissed if my school did that, but that's why the game experience down here will take the cake over that of Southern Cal. SC had to have known about this whole scandal w/ Reggie, so I'd say they've got some issues ahead of them. They run the program like an NFL team, so this doesn't surprise me. Does anyone think it will affect recruiting, though?

[TideRoll]

USC will probably not get hit as hard as Alabama, unless it comes to light that the staff had actual knowledge of his illegal participation and withheld it. All bets are off if an investigation into the program reveals a lot of booster impropriety, and in a wealthy, pro-team oriented, high profile town like LA, that is a real possibility, and I have heard the rumors that there was a good bit of that kind of thing. Just rumors right now, though.

That said, USC is the golden boy for the NCAA right now and likely has a conference commissioner who will look out for them rather than try to sink them, as Bama had (Roy Kramer, you yellow, back-stabbing rat b*stard, esad). If the people at USC are smart, they will learn from the 'Bama lesson and fight the NCAA rather than cooperate. The mistake Bama made was thinking that cooperation was going to help them in any way. It worked against them, and since the NCAA did not even follow their own rules, it makes no sense for any school facing that kind of trouble subsequently to play nice with the NCAA at all. The NCAA is more thoroughly corrupt than any member institution, anyway, but that is another rant.

Many have speculated that USC will eventually have to forfeit all games in which Bush played after he took the money from the agent, which is one common punishment. That may result in the loss of a national title. And it will not go to OK or Auburn, it will just remain vacant.

As for Bush, you can blame him for bringing this heat to his university, and he should face the loss of marketability and reputation, but at the same time, there is a great deal of hypocrisy in big-time college athletics. These 'amatuers' are making tens of millions of dollars for their schools and the NCAA, yet it impossible for them to have a part time job and many do come from poor families.

Where is the line between need and greed? How can you control the family of a recruit or a scholarship athlete when you take him out of athletic dorms and limit his contact with the coaches? Like it or not, the only way the NCAA has to address the issue is by punishing the school involved. The NCAA would have more ability if they were codified and invested with some measure of legal authority, but that is the last thing they want, since then they would have to have due process, oversight, and all the rest that goes along with it. They're happy just raking in the bucks and acting like humanitarians and scholars. What a joke.

[OB1 Stogie]

This is the problem with college athletics. IMO, you cant punish a program NOW, for the actions of a past player. Reggie Bush is now a multi millionaire and will in no way be effected by this. Do the current players deserve to be on probation for past indiscretions???? I guess it decides where you stand on the issue. I do, however, think that the University should have know what was going on when his parents were living in a million dollar home. As a fan of college football and someone who cant stand USC, I'm all for taking away the National Championship...but to punish the future players is a little unfair, IMO.

[preludese111]

Originally Posted by OB1 Stogie

This is the problem with college athletics. IMO, you cant punish a program NOW, for the actions of a past player. Reggie Bush is now a multi millionaire and will in no way be effected by this. Do the current players deserve to be on probation for past indiscretions???? I guess it decides where you stand on the issue. I do, however, think that the University should have know what was going on when his parents were living in a million dollar home. As a fan of college football and someone who cant stand USC, I'm all for taking away the National Championship...but to punish the future players is a little unfair, IMO.

The problem is, it's actually illegal, so punishing him is necessary even though it's in the past. I agree though that the university knew, and I also hate Southern California, so I will be happy to see them get punished. However, they are a bandwagon team and NCAA kisses their asses for that reason and they were overrated this year b/c they rake in a crapload of money for all involved.

[TideRoll]

Well, it is unfair that a team gets punished for something a guy did before a lot of them got there, but at the same time, if if other schools get slammed regardless of the fairness of it, then so should USC. What is good for one school had better be good for another if any facade of respect is to be maintained.

I assume many here have heard the expression that "the best way to get rid of a bad law is to enforce it." Maybe if enough folks got slapped around by the NCAA over this kind of thing, a more suitable solution might result.

[LSU_Stogie]

I don't care one bit about USC losing gametime or being placed on probation...all I want is for every game that Reggie Bush played in to be counted as a forfeit...including the NC game that they "claimed" was a co-championship with LSU and their other win against OU. Also, would like to see the Heisman stripped from Bush. USC will take a hard enough hit with recruiting now...nobody wants to go to a cheating school.

[OB1 Stogie]

USC will take a hard enough hit with recruiting now...nobody wants to go to a cheating school.

Dont think that'll be the case at all...it's been going on forever and most of these recruits no the deal. You know the old saying...."It's only cheating if you get caught."

[gorob23]

Originally Posted by TideRoll

, but at the same time, there is a great deal of hypocrisy in big-time college athletics. These 'amatuers' are making tens of millions of dollars for their schools and the NCAA, yet it impossible for them to have a part time job and many do come from poor families. They're happy just raking in the bucks and acting like humanitarians and scholars. What a joke.

Nothing more needs to be said...

Rob

[preludese111]

Originally Posted by OB1 Stogie

Dont think that'll be the case at all...it's been going on forever and most of these recruits no the deal. You know the old saying...."It's only cheating if you get caught."

When a certain number of scholarships are taken away/not allowed to be given, as one of the sanctions may be, it will hurt recruiting. They won't be able to do much under-the-table dealing b/c they'll be under the watchful eye.

[ky toker]

While I do not like the structure of the Universities, wrong is wrong. The schools have to stay on top of things and be accountable for what happens within it's organization.

Kentucky is finally at the end of it's own sanctions and hope we will be able to up the recruitment and field a more competitive team.

[AAlmeter]

Originally Posted by TideRoll

Well, it is unfair that a team gets punished for something a guy did before a lot of them got there, but at the same time, if if other schools get slammed regardless of the fairness of it, then so should USC. What is good for one school had better be good for another if any facade of respect is to be maintained.

I assume many here have heard the expression that "the best way to get rid of a bad law is to enforce it." Maybe if enough folks got slapped around by the NCAA over this kind of thing, a more suitable solution might result.

F the NCAA, f the moronic limitations, and f title 9