Congress again passes kids health bill

[Bigwaved]

Originally Posted by AAlmeter

Down about 1% over the past 5-6 years

Originally Posted by glking

You had to ask....

Here are more FACTS:

Fact Sheet: October 2007 Marks Record 50th Consecutive Month of Job Growth

8.31 Million Jobs Created Since August 2003 In Longest Continuous Months Of Job Growth On Record
November 2, 2007, the Bureau of Labor Statistics released new jobs figures – 166,000 jobs created in October. Since August 2003, 8.31 million jobs have been created, with 1.68 million jobs created over the 12 months that ended in October. Our economy has now added jobs for 50 straight months – the longest period of uninterrupted job growth on record. The unemployment rate remains low at 4.7 percent.
The U.S. Economy Remains Strong, Flexible, And Dynamic

• Real GDP grew at a strong 3.9 percent in the third quarter of 2007. The economy has now experienced six years of uninterrupted growth, averaging 2.8 percent a year since 2001.

• Real after-tax per capita personal income has risen by 12.7 percent – an average of over $3,800 per person – since President Bush took office.

• Real wages rose 1.2 percent over the 12 months that ended in September. This rise is faster than the average rate during the 1990s.

• Since the first quarter of 2001, productivity growth has averaged 2.6 percent per year. This growth is well above average productivity growth in the 1990s, 1980s, and 1970s.

• The deficit today is at 1.2 percent of GDP, well below the 40-year average. Economic growth contributed to a 6.7 percent rise in tax receipts in FY 2007, following an increase of 11.8 percent in FY 2006.

Would you care to expand on what jobs are being created? I would venture a guess that replacing a middle wage job with two or three minimum wage ones does not constitute growth. Real wage growth of 1.25 versus what cost of living increases? Believe me, if someone cared to look a little, they could surely find data crunching statistics that paint a different picture. Last I checked, this source you mention is part of the government. It is self reporting. It has its leadership position appointed by the President, correct? It seems like like the fox could be in charge of guarding the hen house. I am sure we will see how it all pans out next election. If the economy is so clearly going like gang busters and our direction is preferred, then status quo should prevail.

[Bigwaved]

Originally Posted by adsantos13

Just going to jump in here for a moment to add one point re:the "subprime crisis". You cannot simply say it the fault of people taking out loans in a haphazard fashion. It does play a role, but it is far more complicated than that.

Some people were overzealous investors spurred on by the giant leaps in housing market along with historic low interest rates. They took out loans because they assumed their purchase would appreciate in the booming market and they could then sell the house before the adjustable rate kicked in. These people were speculators and not just schmoes taking out loans they couldn't pay back. When you gamble, sometimes you lose.

Others were irresponsible, and didn't read the fine print or didnt plan their finances very well.

And finally, the big banks. They made A FORTUNE securitizing these subprime loans and as with anything where people are getting rich, they became less and less concerned with the old underwriting standards used to filter who was eligible to be given loans. Further, fortunes were made using predatory lending practices because the banks cutting the loans were turning right around and selling the loans as securities and were no longer concerned with people defaulting.

So, sorry for the OT stuff, but wanted to clear up what I perceived to be an oversimplification.

Actually, it is right on topic. It goes right along with the discussion.

[Papichulo]

Originally Posted by garilla

I think we all are of the same conclusion that the cigar industry should NOT be the sole funder of this. We also generally agree that "children" at age 25 and families making $80K/year are not exactly classified properly to be included in this bill. $80K/year is far from poverty. My apologies if you feel differently, get that fscking silver spoon out of your mouth and take the place of a Marine for a day in the "sandbox", maybe you'll feel differently.

When looking for the answer, the question is summed into ONE word: Why.

"We need this because insurance bills are too high."
Why?

"Because doctors charge too much."
Why?

"Because liability insurance is too much."
Why?

"Because lawsuits are expensive."
Why?

Bottom line is you can chase damn near every type of insurance back to the fact that lawsuits are absolutely out of control.
(NOTE: I have nothing against lawyers, I really can't fault them here, they know the ways to make their income, it just happens to be a LOT more than the average joe makes. Average Joe, don't bitch, invent some moronic device and sell it on the Internet if you want to be a millionaire.)

Our laws regarding lawsuits SUCK. Laws and actions regarding illegal immigrants SUCK. You want to fix any of this? Then keep asking Why until you find the ROOT cause of the problem.

You want to award someone millions for spilling coffee in their lap? Why!?!?!?!? Complete and utter bullshit.

If it keeps going the way it's going, we're going to have a nation of lazy-assed Gen-Z'ers sitting on their ass all day long sucking on the teat of the Government instead of actually doing what so many generations before them did. Earn a living.



- Garilla

I hear you. If we want to fund child care insurance deportation is the answer for the billions of dollars we the taxpayers are spending on illegals.

[glking]

Originally Posted by Bigwaved

Would you care to expand on what jobs are being created? I would venture a guess that replacing a middle wage job with two or three minimum wage ones does not constitute growth. Real wage growth of 1.25 versus what cost of living increases? Believe me, if someone cared to look a little, they could surely find data crunching statistics that paint a different picture. Last I checked, this source you mention is part of the government. It is self reporting. It has its leadership position appointed by the President, correct? It seems like like the fox could be in charge of guarding the hen house. I am sure we will see how it all pans out next election. If the economy is so clearly going like gang busters and our direction is preferred, then status quo should prevail.

You have my sympathy. It must be terrible to be so unhappy and stuck in a country the you mistrust & dislike so much.

[AAlmeter]

Originally Posted by Bigwaved

Would you care to expand on what jobs are being created? I would venture a guess that replacing a middle wage job with two or three minimum wage ones does not constitute growth. Real wage growth of 1.25 versus what cost of living increases? Believe me, if someone cared to look a little, they could surely find data crunching statistics that paint a different picture. Last I checked, this source you mention is part of the government. It is self reporting. It has its leadership position appointed by the President, correct? It seems like like the fox could be in charge of guarding the hen house. I am sure we will see how it all pans out next election. If the economy is so clearly going like gang busters and our direction is preferred, then status quo should prevail.

I thought the world was ending because all of our lower and middle income jobs were being shipped overseas? Now you're saying it's ending because we're increasing the number of lower income jobs?

[adsantos13]

Originally Posted by glking

You have my sympathy. It must be terrible to be so unhappy and stuck in a country the you mistrust & dislike so much.

Uhhh, where exactly did Bigwaved say he disliked America? Expressing a point of view where you think something can be done differently or better or contrary to someone else's does not equate with being anti-american.

But what do I know, Im the son of an immigrant who probably should of been deported.

[JAK]

Originally Posted by adsantos13

Uhhh, where exactly did Bigwaved say he disliked America? Expressing a point of view where you think something can be done differently or better or contrary to someone else's does not equate with being anti-american.

But what do I know, Im the son of an immigrant who probably should of been deported.

I agree with Bigwaved. And I don't hate America, if I hated the place I would leave. Its because I LOVE America that I want to see it at its best, which is not where it's at right now.

[glking]

Originally Posted by adsantos13

Uhhh, where exactly did Bigwaved say he disliked America? Expressing a point of view where you think something can be done differently or better or contrary to someone else's does not equate with being anti-american.

But what do I know, Im the son of an immigrant who probably should of been deported.

Perception is everything. I have yet to hear a single positive comment about our country from Bigwaved.

If a positive fact about the country is brought up, it is labeled a lie.

If a negative lie is brought up, it is automatically assumd to be true.

I would love to hear about ways of doing things better.

[adsantos13]

Originally Posted by glking

Perception is everything. I have yet to hear a single positive comment about our country from Bigwaved.

If a positive fact about the country is brought up, it is labeled a lie.

If a negative lie is brought up, it is automatically assumd to be true.

I would love to hear about ways of doing things better.

Maybe you haven't heard a positive comment because this thread is specifically arguing one relatively small aspect of the United States and its domestic policies.

Anyway, I am going to stop speaking for Bigwaved. I will say though, that I love America and would not want to live anywhere else. Further, everyday I wake up I feel lucky to live in a country where I can say, do, work, and live as I please. Going further, feeling this way does not mean I cannot find one or many things wrong with the United States. There is no such thing as utopia and Im thankful that at least, we have the right to actually discuss ideas freely and try to implement changes for the better.

Its sad that polticial rhetoric has become so polarized that it now equates opposing arguments as dangerous, unpatriotic, and signifying a hatred for the country (sadly, these tactics are exploited by both sides of the spectrum).

[Bigwaved]

Originally Posted by glking

Perception is everything. I have yet to hear a single positive comment about our country from Bigwaved.

If a positive fact about the country is brought up, it is labeled a lie.

If a negative lie is brought up, it is automatically assumd to be true.

I would love to hear about ways of doing things better.

You, my friend, are assuming a lot. That, my friend, does not surprise me. You, my friend, are easily confused, in my opinion. I, on the other hand, do not confuse my country and what it stands for. I know for sure it is not poor policy or politics. That surely escapes you, but again, I am not surprised by this. I am not offended by your assumption though. I know exactly how I feel. So, you can keep your sympathy. I can do without it.

[GoodFella]

i love the usa
ya there is a few problems
after living is other countries and coming here its the best place
i just dont want to work extra hard to support my family and some crack head
so stop watching michael moore and step back from the bong

[Bigwaved]

Originally Posted by AAlmeter

I thought the world was ending because all of our lower and middle income jobs were being shipped overseas? Now you're saying it's ending because we're increasing the number of lower income jobs?

Well, the world is not ending, but you can make any leap you desire. I do believe you can have multiple reasons that can be attributed to something. Your straw man argument is what is though...

[adsantos13]

Originally Posted by GoodFella

i love the usa
ya there is a few problems
after living is other countries and coming here its the best place
i just dont want to work extra hard to support my family and some crack head
so stop watching michael moore and step back from the bong

Step back from the bong??

What are you talking about?

[Bigwaved]

Originally Posted by GoodFella

i love the usa
ya there is a few problems
after living is other countries and coming here its the best place
i just dont want to work extra hard to support my family and some crack head
so stop watching michael moore and step back from the bong

I find this comment laughable. If someone disagrees with your opinion, then they must be watching Michael Moore or smoking dope? Wow...

[GoodFella]

liberals