Do we really have a right to smoke?

[tobacmon]

Paul, you said it about as plain as plain can be and right on the money. If ya can't understand that then you just can't read.[/QUOTE]


Why thank you---

[Delsana]

Good Morning,

Onto my responses...

Truthfully, while they may be opinions, I can assure you they aren't my own interpretations of it, after all... they're very blatant.

Regardless, if the topic is too sensitive (seems to be too sensitive almost everywhere), then I'll let it be.

However as I previously stated initially, in all technicality and legal form, there is truly nothing "giving" us this "right". Which probably is the main reason you're having so much struggle with it, because even if your stance is that your rights are being infringed upon, and that it's wrong... well just look at what 9/11 did to our country. People don't care if the rights are infringed upon, if we're safe, and as such they may be pushing this underneath those desires to be safe (from all things), and so you may be fighting a losing battle, despite each victory you have, many more losses take places, and many more activitists are there to fill the void.

But, I for one, am a person supporting your desires, though on the more intellectual level is where I stand, and as such while it may seem or even be futile, and giving up definitely isn't the answer, it looks bleak, unless you can find a new and more "effective" stance.

Edit:

Also to the statements towards me, understand once more that I have stated neither yay nor nay, and thus don't try to judge me, as I am not particularly judging you as much as once more focusing on the intellectual side of this discussion so as to give it a more "logical" view.

[zeavran1]

Unfortunately, due to boredom, I have officially lost interest with this thread.

[danmcmartin]

As I always tell my wife, I'm right, your wrong, end of disucssion.

I don't expect that to work any better here then it does with her.

[Cigary]

Originally Posted by Delsana

Good Morning,

Onto my responses...

Truthfully, while they may be opinions, I can assure you they aren't my own interpretations of it, after all... they're very blatant.

Regardless, if the topic is too sensitive (seems to be too sensitive almost everywhere), then I'll let it be.

However as I previously stated initially, in all technicality and legal form, there is truly nothing "giving" us this "right". Which probably is the main reason you're having so much struggle with it, because even if your stance is that your rights are being infringed upon, and that it's wrong... well just look at what 9/11 did to our country. People don't care if the rights are infringed upon, if we're safe, and as such they may be pushing this underneath those desires to be safe (from all things), and so you may be fighting a losing battle, despite each victory you have, many more losses take places, and many more activitists are there to fill the void.

But, I for one, am a person supporting your desires, though on the more intellectual level is where I stand, and as such while it may seem or even be futile, and giving up definitely isn't the answer, it looks bleak, unless you can find a new and more "effective" stance.

Edit:

Also to the statements towards me, understand once more that I have stated neither yay nor nay, and thus don't try to judge me, as I am not particularly judging you as much as once more focusing on the intellectual side of this discussion so as to give it a more "logical" view.

Nice to know that you are on a higher intellectual level. zzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[commonsenseman]

Originally Posted by Delsana

Also to the statements towards me, understand once more that I have stated neither yay nor nay, and thus don't try to judge me, as I am not particularly judging you as much as once more focusing on the intellectual side of this discussion so as to give it a more "logical" view.

You did state that you think smoking is morally wrong actually.

"many people say "God-given rights", and then they respect, and even worship or thank God for their ability to smoke, do drugs, and other such things (because after all these things were created or at least their initial forms were formed by God during the creation and forming of this planet), which while it sounds right, you also have to look into what the Bible and what religion really does state, and very blatantly two things are stated.

1. Your body is the Temple of God, as such you will do no harm to it, or project any defacement.

2. God is to come first in your life, thus the rules are blatant, you have no decision or violation in such cases, and it isn't up for interpretation, and while God may not actually have you kill your first-born son, if he asks or tells you to, you will be willing to do so, for His will and His work is greater than us all."

You're not looking at it from an intellectual level at all.

P.S. Did you just join this forum to get in arguments???

[Delsana]

No, indeed I made an account for several reasons, one such reason to discuss this and a few other things, I hate arguments.

First, I didn't say it was morally wrong, I said it was religiously wrong, I didn't say I was against or for it, simply tried to rid the excuses for said actions. However, since religious conversations aren't warranted or wanted here, I'll end that side, though I definitely did look at it from an intellectual side on the religious form, as well as the non religious reasons why there is no true "right", which are as I stated below.

[Plop007]

Originally Posted by defcon3

I would say that your interpretation of 1 Cor. 16:19-20 is skewed...

This is a typical response for Christians who don't smoke or drink, it's sad/funny as the same ones who stuff white-sugar, fat, McDonalds, soggy donuts, junk food and all other kinds of processed foods and poison into their couch-potato-temples as they condemn one and condone another...

I am follower of Christ, obviously far from perfect, and do my best not to judge another believer as instructed...

Perhaps this specific verse given to the church of Corinth was more to do with prostitution, adultery, and using their bodies in pagan rituals, then personal views on tobacco and drinking...

Colossians 2:16

Totally agree with you man.

I myself am a Catholic, Christian. I believe we do have the right to smoke or drink. I know people have different interpertations on verses and things in the Bible but hey Life is short and we might not be saints but we can live together in happiness under God I say just respect God and others and dont be a dick and you will do fine in life.

[Delsana]

Originally Posted by Plop007

Totally agree with you man.

I myself am a Catholic, Christian. I believe we do have the right to smoke or drink. I know people have different interpertations on verses and things in the Bible but hey Life is short and we might not be saints but we can live together in happiness under God I say just respect God and others and dont be a dick and you will do fine in life.

I tried to be more blatant but it seems I wasn't clear enough.

The problem and reason religion is so skewed is because we can continue to reinterpret very blatant facts and laws or rules, and even commandments; making them mean other things.

I do not "interpret" I read it as it is, and I can not see how in any feasible manner you could interpret it in any other way. Now via forgiveness, you will of course be forgiven, however that would mean you have to also work towards not making the same violations.

I state this simply because I don't like seeing others make excuses for things, when they're unneeded and accomplish nothing. Accept your flaws and failings, and even sins, and instead work towards improvement.

[madurolover]

Religious threads are not allowed at Puff so I am going to close this thread.

If another mod wants to reopen it please feel free to do so.
If anyone else has a good reason why it should be reopened then pm me or another mod and we will discuss whether to do so or not.