Xikar Crystal Humidifier Jar Question [Archive] - Puff Cigar Discussion Forums

: Xikar Crystal Humidifier Jar Question


Tarks
03-08-2009, 07:41 PM
Hi all,

I paid a visit to my local tobacconist last week to purchase the Xikar crystal product for my 150 ct humidor (That is currently full). The fellow that was working told me that I would need to purchase three jars for my humidor. I'm no expert, but three jars sounded a bit much so I decided to only purchased two. Besides, I don't have room for 3. When I got home I went to the Xikar website and found the following information.

Crystal Humidifier Jar:

Slow, steady release of constant Humidity of 70%
Lasts up to 90 days before re-fill
Regulates humidity for up to 150 cigars
Safe, effective, and very easy to use!
Just unscrew the top and place in your humidor!
Re-fill with our pre-mixed PG solution
My questions are:

1) Was the guy at the tobacoonist full of it, trying to over sell the product or was he correct to tell me that I would need three jars?

2) My humidor has been sitting for two full days with the Xikar product and is at 75% RH. Will two jars last longer than one or should I remove one of the jars? Common sense tells me to keep them both in the humidor but expert advise would be reassuring.

Thanks.

MKR160
03-08-2009, 08:04 PM
I currently have a Savoy 100ct humidor that is full. In it I have a Puck 65%-100ct, and 2 Xikar Jars. I keep the jars in there for the winter months as it gets dry here in the Northeast in the winters. I usually take one of them out in the summer. Hope this helps.

docruger
03-08-2009, 08:30 PM
sounds good but i dont have ant trouble with using the old 50/50 in mine

Tarks
03-08-2009, 08:33 PM
sounds good but i dont have ant trouble with using the old 50/50 in mine

So, might be a dumb question but here it goes. When my Xikar jars run out can I just fill them with 50/50 solution rather than purchasing the refills from Xikar? Would this be the same?

XIKAR
03-09-2009, 12:24 PM
Hey guys,
Jacob from XIKAR. Good questions and comments.

First to answer Tarks' question. Three jars sounds a bit excessive, but there are many factors to consider. Do you live in an arid environment? How often you open your humidor? And how full do you keep your humidor? They all effect your RH. If you live in the dessert, smoke all day, and only kept a couple of days supply then you would need more humidification, because you would be constantly losing it.

I hope your retailer is not trying to over sell you. He may just be working from his experiences. Just keep an eye on the RH. If you are holding constant with two jars leave them both in, but if you are curious you can always take one out and monitor closely.

As for the great 50/50 question. Any talk about PG (Propylene Glycol) is an interesting one. PG naturally absorbs moisture just like salt, to keep the humidity at 70%, no more no less. BUT, too much PG with not enough distilled water will clog your humidifier. Think of it as PG = a Churchill and Distilled H20= a Robusto. If you buy 4 of each every week, but you smoke the Robustos twice as often. Soon your humidor won't have room for Robustos because it is full of Churchills. At that point you have no moisture.

On the other hand, too little PG and you will have humidity spikes that can harm your cigars. The reason being is that PG biodegrades at a specific rate. The PG and Water don't actually make a solution (it's a mixture like an egg yoke where the PG is the white part). If you don't have enough PG, you end up with just distilled water in your humidifier before your refill, and your RH levels spike before plummeting.

We recommend our premixed PG because its mixture was tested to allow PG to biodegrade at the same rate as moisture dissipates.

There you go. If you guys want the long version on any topic feel free to ask me anytime.

friz
07-11-2009, 12:43 AM
Hey guys,
Jacob from XIKAR. Good questions and comments.

First to answer Tarks' question. Three jars sounds a bit excessive, but there are many factors to consider. Do you live in an arid environment? How often you open your humidor? And how full do you keep your humidor? They all effect your RH. If you live in the dessert, smoke all day, and only kept a couple of days supply then you would need more humidification, because you would be constantly losing it.

I hope your retailer is not trying to over sell you. He may just be working from his experiences. Just keep an eye on the RH. If you are holding constant with two jars leave them both in, but if you are curious you can always take one out and monitor closely.

As for the great 50/50 question. Any talk about PG (Propylene Glycol) is an interesting one. PG naturally absorbs moisture just like salt, to keep the humidity at 70%, no more no less. BUT, too much PG with not enough distilled water will clog your humidifier. Think of it as PG = a Churchill and Distilled H20= a Robusto. If you buy 4 of each every week, but you smoke the Robustos twice as often. Soon your humidor won't have room for Robustos because it is full of Churchills. At that point you have no moisture.

On the other hand, too little PG and you will have humidity spikes that can harm your cigars. The reason being is that PG biodegrades at a specific rate. The PG and Water don't actually make a solution (it's a mixture like an egg yoke where the PG is the white part). If you don't have enough PG, you end up with just distilled water in your humidifier before your refill, and your RH levels spike before plummeting.

We recommend our premixed PG because its mixture was tested to allow PG to biodegrade at the same rate as moisture dissipates.

There you go. If you guys want the long version on any topic feel free to ask me anytime.

If I have had mine for a year should I replace it with a new one. What if the life span on these

defcon3
07-11-2009, 01:52 AM
Very interesting post Tarks... I have three 2oz. jars of the regular gel and a 100 count vertical humidor...

I have been using the large foam element "distilled water only - no pg" as I am uncertain how many jars to put in there... I keep the foam element on the bottom and a drymistat tube on the top shelf to suck up any extra moisture. For some reason that defies logic, the humidity seems to rise to the top hence the drymistat tube up top...

sodomanaz
07-11-2009, 09:54 AM
Distilled water in the jars is just fine. Don't over-think or over-spend on these things. :) General rule of thumb is 150 to a 2oz. jar, but it varies with location humidity, what you have in your humidors, etc etc (like what was already mentioned). I like to keep my humidors as close to 65% as possible, so I play around taking jars out and checking to see where the humidor is sitting without any humidification, then add as I see fit.

But really, don't drive yourself nuts with this. If your humidor is properly seasoned, you could probably pull out all of the jars and go without any humidification for possibly 2 good weeks. :)

defcon3
07-11-2009, 02:37 PM
But really, don't drive yourself nuts with this. If your humidor is properly seasoned, you could probably pull out all of the jars and go without any humidification for possibly 2 good weeks.

Agreed sodomanaz...

But my mind wonders if the jars maintain 70% humidity, wouldn't it be impossible to technically use too many jars? It would merely provide more time before having to freshen them up with distilled water?

Tarks
07-11-2009, 06:53 PM
Just an update since this thread is 4 months old. I now use 65% Heartfelt beads for my humidification. Nothing else made sense compared to these beads and personally I do not understand why a person would not use these. They are flawless!

fiddlegrin
07-11-2009, 07:49 PM
Ya Buddy!

Me too!

They are the only way to fly!!!

defcon3
07-11-2009, 09:14 PM
Wow!!! I had no idea the thread was that old...

I guess I will at least look into the hype that everyone is saying about these "Hearfelt Beads" being the greatest invention since sliced bread...

I say use apple cores like in the old days...

Tarks
07-11-2009, 10:01 PM
I say use apple cores like in the old days...

muahahahahaha!!!

sckfck
03-18-2011, 01:25 AM
Years after this thread was written...

I recently purchased two 4oz Xikar humidifiers from my local cigar lounge. Maaaan..... did the owner up sale me. He said I would need the two 4oz jars to humidify 50-100 cigars.. I wish I would have joined PUFF one or two days sooner.

dahu
05-15-2011, 12:41 AM
Xikar Drymistat Humidifier (tube)
is it necessary to remove the cap on these to be functional?
The description says that "moisture is released through the cap and millions of microscopic pores in the tube."
Are the millions of pores sufficient in a travel humidor?
I ask becuase I am worried about any excess fluid saturating the foam of a travel humidor (cigarcaddy) that I am using for extended storage (a month or two at a time)

sorry if this is a stupid question. I am just getting into cigars.
also, thanks for everyone on Puff for the great posts. I have been lurking around for a few days trying to take it all in.
-dan

Hinson
05-15-2011, 12:54 AM
Xikar Drymistat Humidifier (tube)
is it necessary to remove the cap on these to be functional?
The description says that "moisture is released through the cap and millions of microscopic pores in the tube."
Are the millions of pores sufficient in a travel humidor?
I ask becuase I am worried about any excess fluid saturating the foam of a travel humidor (cigarcaddy) that I am using for extended storage (a month or two at a time)

sorry if this is a stupid question. I am just getting into cigars.
also, thanks for everyone on Puff for the great posts. I have been lurking around for a few days trying to take it all in.
-dan
Dan, I have one of these in my 25ct and I have never noticed any leakage from it. It has been in there for a few weeks and keeps a steady 70%. Not sure how it would handle being in foam though.

dahu
05-15-2011, 02:24 AM
thanks for the reply Shannon.

I think I will be in and out of the traveler often enough to keep an eye on the foam, but do you think the tubes can still function with the cap still on? Based on the product description, it makes me believe that the micro pores will allow for a slow and steady humidity control, but I have yet to talk with anyone who has used them in this way.

Mante
05-15-2011, 02:33 AM
thanks for the reply Shannon.

I think I will be in and out of the traveler often enough to keep an eye on the foam, but do you think the tubes can still function with the cap still on? Based on the product description, it makes me believe that the micro pores will allow for a slow and steady humidity control, but I have yet to talk with anyone who has used them in this way.Whenever I've used those tubes in temporary storage I have always removed the cap & experienced no leakage. If you have a hygrometer, throw the tube in a tupperware container with it for a day each with the cap on then with it off & see what happens .

dahu
05-15-2011, 02:42 AM
Whenever I've used those tubes in temporary storage I have always removed the cap & experienced no leakage. If you have a hygrometer, throw the tube in a tupperware container with it for a day each with the cap on then with it off & see what happens .

Wait, so I have to do some kind of experiment on my own? I can't just be a newb and ask a question on a message board and expect all kinds of responces? Jk :)

In all seriousness though, thanks Tashaz, that's a really good idea, I will give it a shot, I should have thought to try that.

Mante
05-15-2011, 02:43 AM
Wait, so I have to do some kind of experiment on my own? I can't just be a newb and ask a question on a message board and expect all kinds of responces? Jk :)

In all seriousness though, thanks Tashaz, that's a really good idea, I will give it a shot, I should have thought to try that.LMAO. :smile:

Hinson
05-16-2011, 01:14 AM
Lol, the only issue I had was that initially I had this tube in a 25ct box but only had like 5 smokes in it. The ph was really low, so I called CI, where I got it, and asked what was up. The guy explained that I needed to add more sticks to the box. Low and behold 24hrs after adding more the ph jump to a perfect level. Been holding steady for weeks. So not sure if this will have an effect on your travel box.

Mante
05-16-2011, 06:50 AM
Lol, the only issue I had was that initially I had this tube in a 25ct box but only had like 5 smokes in it. The ph was really low, so I called CI, where I got it, and asked what was up. The guy explained that I needed to add more sticks to the box. Low and behold 24hrs after adding more the ph jump to a perfect level. Been holding steady for weeks. So not sure if this will have an effect on your travel box.That would be "RH" Shannon. :wink:

Hinson
05-16-2011, 07:11 PM
That would be "RH" Shannon. :wink:

Yup you are right. Got a little tipsy last night after work. Thanks.

Stonedog
09-22-2011, 01:59 PM
Hi Everyone,

Sorry to bring this thread back to life - didn't want to start a new one.

I just picked up a 4oz jar of this stuff for my brand new 100ct humidor and have a few questions:

1) If this is supposed to regulate humidity to 70% do I still need the green foam humidifier that came with the unit?

2) In theory, should this jar handle the humidification needs as well as the beads I see mentioned elsewhere and if not why?

Thanks!

bombsquadmike007
09-22-2011, 02:23 PM
Reminded me I have to top mine off.

asmartbull
09-22-2011, 02:25 PM
Hi Everyone,

Sorry to bring this thread back to life - didn't want to start a new one.

I just picked up a 4oz jar of this stuff for my brand new 100ct humidor and have a few questions:

1) If this is supposed to regulate humidity to 70% do I still need the green foam humidifier that came with the unit? won't regulate, It only adds RH

2) In theory, should this jar handle the humidification needs as well as the beads I see mentioned elsewhere and if not why? Totally different animal
and inferior to beads/kl

Thanks!

The problem with gels is that it doesn't regulate, it only adds it.
Unless you use the PG solution, you need to watch for mold.....trust me.
Some do use it in the Winter to help when the RH tends to drop.

Stonedog
09-22-2011, 02:37 PM
The problem with gels is that it doesn't regulate, it only adds it.
Unless you use the PG solution, you need to watch for mold.....trust me.
Some do use it in the Winter to help when the RH tends to drop.

Hmmm... I'm being unusually dense today...

In other words, the jar says it "Regulates Humidity to 70% RH" but the reality is that it will keep it pegged at 70% or higher, right?

dahu
09-22-2011, 02:50 PM
Hmmm... I'm being unusually dense today...

In other words, the jar says it "Regulates Humidity to 70% RH" but the reality is that it will keep pegged at 70% or higher, right?

I used the jar and solution for about 3 weeks and then ditched it for Kitty Litter in a charcoal net- the type used in fish tanks.

The problem I kept running into was that it would hold at 70%, but if the ambient rH rose, the jar would simply stop "giving off" humidity, not absorb excess humidity. I guess what I am trying to say is that it will get you close to 70% if your rH is lower than 70%. If your rH is higher than 70% the jar does nothing to help the problem.

Kitty litter, on the other hand, will help both ways. If you have high rH just add some dry KL to the humi in a tied off nylon, charcoal bag, cigar tube, etc and the silica will absorb excess moisture down to about 63%. If you are lower than 60% just sprits the KL with distilled water a couple times and the rH will begin to rise.

most cigars are going to smoke better at 65% or less, so the 70% is high anyway.
hope this helped and wasn’t confusing!

asmartbull
09-22-2011, 02:58 PM
Hmmm... I'm being unusually dense today...

In other words, the jar says it "Regulates Humidity to 70% RH" but the reality is that it will keep it pegged at 70% or higher, right?

Jon
Gel does not absorb any RH. ( One way street)

Beads/KL will will regulate RH ( two way street)

Stonedog
09-22-2011, 03:05 PM
I used the jar and solution for about 3 weeks and then ditched it for Kitty Litter in a charcoal net- the type used in fish tanks.

The problem I kept running into was that it would hold at 70%, but if the ambient rH rose, the jar would simply stop "giving off" humidity, not absorb excess humidity. I guess what I am trying to say is that it will get you close to 70% if your rH is lower than 70%. If your rH is higher than 70% the jar does nothing to help the problem.

Kitty litter, on the other hand, will help both ways. If you have high rH just add some dry KL to the humi in a tied off nylon, charcoal bag, cigar tube, etc and the silica will absorb excess moisture down to about 63%. If you are lower than 60% just sprits the KL with distilled water a couple times and the rH will begin to rise.

most cigars are going to smoke better at 65% or less, so the 70% is high anyway.
hope this helped and wasn’t confusing!

Not confusing, no. I think I still don't get it though. I have a feeling my humidor will slowly leak humidity since it's a low-end model. If this is the case won't the gel act like a sort of governor that keeps the humidity from dropping below certain point? It might spike up for some reason, but in the winter months the house gets very dry (and so RH in humidor will drop) and this gel will release and try to bring the RH back up?

I should probably shut up and just listen to you guys since I'm a complete newb, but the questions just keep coming. (sorry)

And this is going off topic, but is 65% RH better for long term storage than 70%?

Max_Power
09-22-2011, 03:13 PM
Not confusing, no. I think I still don't get it though. I have a feeling my humidor will slowly leak humidity since it's a low-end model. If this is the case won't the gel act like a sort of governor that keeps the humidity from dropping below certain point? It might spike up for some reason, but in the winter months the house gets very dry (and so RH in humidor will drop) and this gel will release and try to bring the RH back up?

I should probably shut up and just listen to you guys since I'm a complete newb, but the questions just keep coming. (sorry)

And this is going off topic, but is 65% RH better for long term storage than 70%?

Most find 65% preferable than 70, both for long term and otherwise. I find sticks stored at 70 to more often have tight draws and burn issues than ones stored at 65.

Also, KL or beads will also release moisture when the RH drops below 65 and absorb when its over 65.

I use beads in my 2 desktops and add extra KL in the winter when my house RH drops down low and so far they have been great. 1 of them is cheap and doesn't have the greatest seal but it still holds pretty steady.

Just KL in my cooler and for almost a year it has been holding at 65 perfectly. I had to spray the KL a couple of times over the winter but that was it.

Stonedog
09-22-2011, 03:27 PM
Thanks everyone, I think I get it now. I'm going to see how it goes for a month or two and if necessary add a stick of HF beads.

Most find 65% preferable than 70, both for long term and otherwise. I find sticks stored at 70 to more often have tight draws and burn issues than ones stored at 65.

Also, KL or beads will also release moisture when the RH drops below 65 and absorb when its over 65.

I use beads in my 2 desktops and add extra KL in the winter when my house RH drops down low and so far they have been great. 1 of them is cheap and doesn't have the greatest seal but it still holds pretty steady.

Just KL in my cooler and for almost a year it has been holding at 65 perfectly. I had to spray the KL a couple of times over the winter but that was it.

dahu
09-22-2011, 03:55 PM
Thanks everyone, I think I get it now. I'm going to see how it goes for a month or two and if necessary add a stick of HF beads.

you are not going to want to add a stick of beads, you will most likely just want to replace the jar. You will just oversaturate the beads if they are in there with a jar. Initially it will look like it is working fine, the rH will fall while the beads are absorbing any humidity over 65% faster than the gel is giving off humidity to 70%, but the beads can only hold so much and then your rH will start creeping back up near 70%.